Front brakes locking up?

[91 LTD]

Have been "experimenting" (where safe) w/ braking char., under heavy load front brakes will lock up. Is this normal for police pkg., or anyone elses car? Anything I can do to change it? Car skids nice and straight and makes lots of smoke and if its just par for the course its not like I dont know how to pump the brakes. Frickin hot here. Muchas grabbyass and bonus knockers (nachos?).

[mrltd]

that because stock brakes blow...I totalled a car because of the pathetic brakes....all they did was lock up...couldn't get them to pulse and stop the car.

Tires and the rest of the front suspension have a big effect on the effectiveness of the front brakes also

[Blaze86Vic]

If your brakes are locking your tires up, they are good enough to stop the car. Maybe not twice lol, but at least once. The absolute biggest impact of braking where brakes are not faulty, is TIRES! Get good tires. They are all supposed to lock up at once. This is usually not the case. Which is better, hard to say, front loses steering, but rear gets very wondery.... so it boils down to preference I guess.

Upgrading the brakes is not a bad idea though. These are big cars, and a huge part of performance is stopping. Many people fail to notice this. The reason most Porsches are so fast is because of the 1000hp+ in braking that they have.

[Lincolnmania]

stock brakes are crap........i gotta be careful driving other peoples boxes because i always forget how well my towny stops
locking up your brakes is dangerous, esp when it's the fronts.........if youre gonna push the box to the point of locking the brakes,i highly suggest a big brake conversion and rear discs............they saved my father and my son and my towny last summer when my dad and my son were driving the car.......tractor trailer pulled out in front of them......there was nowhere to go but ahead......my dad was amazed that the towny stopped in enough time to avoid the truck and that the brakes did not lock up
scott

[mrltd]

Springs and shocks also have a lot to do with it. They control how much wieght gets transferred to the tires and pavement....

[91 LTD]

Tires are Generals, they look like decent tires and theyre in good cond. Stock (police pkg) front brakes are these huge discs and the rotors and pads are in really good shape. Suspension also seems to be in good order (stiff). Im wondering could this have something to do w/ the fact that this was a highway cop car, cause Ive had to do some accident avoidance on the highway and the brakes work ultra good at 70-80mph? In this case I was just foolin around w/ doin more or less 35mph and hammerin on the brakes as I came to a red light, nothing extreme.

[Lincolnmania]

those stock 91 rotors are tiny mang

[91 LTD]

They look big to me, but I will defer to the experts (you all) and not put too much faith in them till an upgrade. Would some new brake pads help? Also just out of curiosity is it possible to add abs? Would it even be worth the hassle? What would be the ghetto way (cheapest) to upgrade the brakes, junkyard and later model interceptor (of which I assume there are tons, cause this is LA) or mustang?

[85crownHPP]

if you hammer on any non abs brakes they will lock up!
You should practice braking at the point just before they lock up. if they do lock up, then let off and re-apply. Then you can get an idea of your braking distance.

[91 LTD]

I see where your coming from but no worries dude I know how to pump brakes (had access to an empty ski area parking lot in the winter as a teen to learn how to skid and slide, at night under the lights, snowing, car full of stoned teens (wearing seatbelts) going sideways, worst thing you could hit was a snowbank, good times). I guess my real question was if the situation I described was "par for the course" for my set up, sounds like it is. Gonna do the fr bearings soon and throw in some new pads, any suggestions?

[Blaze86Vic]

I'm with pete here. Try to practice threshold braking. With non-abs brakes threshold braking is way better than pumping brakes.

[mrltd]

if you hammer on any non abs brakes they will lock up!
You should practice braking at the point just before they lock up. if they do lock up, then let off and re-apply. Then you can get an idea of your braking distance.


Not true...If the brakes,suspesnion, and tires all work together,they won't. Or I guess the opposite too, if the brakes aren't right...

But , what I was getting at was the 4 wheel disc on my mustang...you could hit it in the rain and it wouldn't lock up...it'd throw you through the windshield. My old vic was like that too, really tough to lock up the brakes. All the other panthers I had would lock up before stopping, without really hitting the brakes hard. And if it was wet, it was like driving on ice. Tap the brakes and instant slide.


Pad recomendations. I had reybestos silvers on my PI braked car. Worked pretty well.

And yeah the brakes on theses cars are small in comparison...11" rotors. Thunderbirds, Lincoln Mar 7's, and Mustangs, all had 11 brakes....and are much lighter cars....Newer stangs have 12-13" brakes, the vics and marqs have 12"

[turbo2256b]

I have had trouble with lock up before there seems to be a ballance point between adjustment of the rears vs the fronts. The rears adjusted up too much seems to cause the fronts to lock up quicker. Also I swear every time I hit the brakes on these cars the pedle gets a little more play. Finaily one day you realize there is to much play in the pedal nad the rears need adjusted up. Also there cars were designed for old people and eveythig is low effort. I have been thinking about ditching the power steering. It turns to easy little road feel and dosent return back very well on its own. Of course I drove a 455 Buick powered 64 Ford truck with kingpins so bad the I beam was wore through at the pins for years.

[mrltd]

Don't ditch the power steering...upgrade it! I've got an 02 PI box in my wagon now and it's incredible. Nice heavy feel, better ratio, less assist.

[Southern_Pride]

My brakes are stock and dont lock up. Car used to pitch you threw the windshield when I had little tires on the front. Its hard to lock up them mickey t's.

[DuceAnAHalf]

If you can lock your tires, the brakes are fine. you can take a set of 13" 6-piston Brembos and a set of shitty tires and they will lock up instantly. Get a good set of tires.

When you lock up the brakes you have overpowered the force of friction between the tires and the road. Increase the friction between the road and tires and you can use more braking force to stop the car.

My stock brakes will haul my 85 to a stop fast. With the 165s on the car i have to be carefull to not lock them up with anything over half braking effort. Even with the busted 215s i had i could hammer the brakes pretty hard. I have not tried them yet with the 255's

[mrltd]

Again, tires are the biggie...But the springs and shock make a big difference also...they put the weight on the tires..

[DuceAnAHalf]

I should throw the 325s up front. 60 ft 60-0. no way in hell i could lock tjose fuckers up.

[mrltd]

LOL, yeah... I could lock my 245's up easy with the stock suspension and brakes (See autocross vid). With the new brakes and suspension it won't-even with kinda wet roads. And it'll throw you through the windshield.

[DuceAnAHalf]

LOL, yeah... I could lock my 245's up easy with the stock suspension and brakes (See autocross vid). With the new brakes and suspension it won't-even with kinda wet roads. And it'll throw you through the windshield.
My brother has the 13" Cobra brakes with the 2 piston PBR calipers and 245s up front. at 10 mph it almost put me through the windshield, luckily i already had my hand on the dash.

[mrltd]

Yeah, on a t-bird...tad less momentum there ;) ...My old 87 coupe would put you throuh the windshield also...11" fronts, t-bird turbocoupe rear discs, SVo MC, stainless hoses....never locked up either...Perfect brakes.

[85crownHPP]

hhhmmm.... I hope my big brake swap is as sucessfull :D

[85MercPark]

Don't ditch the power steering...upgrade it! I've got an 02 PI box in my wagon now and it's incredible. Nice heavy feel, better ratio, less assist.

Was gonna ask about that, is it a straight swap?

85 - 02

[mrltd]

Was gonna ask about that, is it a straight swap?

85 - 02


Not quite...but not that difficult.

[gadget73]

There is some work with the steering shaft and the lines. Pitman arm is a direct swap and it bolts right to the frame. Not a terrible amount of work, more annoying than anything. I think the worst part of mine was just getting the collapsable part of the steering shaft un-seized. The whole thing had rusted itself solid, and we had to heat the thing till it was glowing, then take after it with a BFH to make it let go.

[85MercPark]

Will put that on my dream list....:2up:

[turbo2256b]

What about the lines?

[Archangel]

Threads are different for from what I've heard, the '80s pressure line won't thread in the 2002 steering box and vice versa, the 2002 pressure line won't thread in the '80s power steering pump. Or something like that.

[RoyLPita]

And you do not have to upgrade the master cylinder?

Nope. Works fine with the stock one. I probably will be upgrading mine though.

[91 LTD]

If you can lock your tires, the brakes are fine. Get a good set of tires.
Any suggestions as to a good "all road" tire. When Puff is fully operational she will be spending some time off of the blacktop in Baja, Mexico.

[85crownHPP]

hhmmm... there arent too many tires with good street performance and dirt performance... if there are Im sure they are expensive...
I bet sport truck tires would be something to look into...

[91 LTD]

Interesting.