Help with camshaft?

[91grandmarquis]

Well Ill have the heads off and such for the build and even though Im probably going to roll the direction of an HO cam, I could get some measurements if you guys would like me to. Not till this summer though.

[import convert]

the thing to watch out for is most 302 specs and "do's and dont's" are based on HO motors that have a dish to them or reliefs (i forget which) so if it fits on a HO motor it may not fit for a lopo motor. like ive read that an F cam can fit on an HO motor but it probably wont work for us. i did fit an E cam in my lopo though i so recomend against it unless you got 3.73s or something around there.

iv also read of mustangs with a stock cam and 1.7 rockers beating a mustang with an E cam in it which should tell you something right there "cough" (get a cam that works with your operating range) "cough"

an explorer cam with 1.7 rockers should be plenty for whatever you do unless you got like 4.10s and a 4000 stall converter and drag race the car all the time.

and yea letter cams suck for anything that has weight to it like our cars and i found out the hard way. no power till like 2800 rpms and even then it ran out of gas in 3rd after like 4k and in 4th had no power with the 2.73s in the back

[91grandmarquis]

Ok so the explorer cam will be more suited for me then, What year were they found in? Any year they had 5.0s? Also I was talking about a stock HO cam, And I do realize that our pistons don't have reliefs for the valves so that is something that come in to play as well as most of you have explained.

[import convert]

from what ive seen on here the HO cam is not a bad swap but is a little sluggish under 2500 rpms compared to the explorer cam but youll have more top end power. if you want instant power then do the explorer cam. you can get one from any explorer with the gt40p heads or like 95 to 2001 i think. i got mine from a 97 explorer but i bought it brand new through work. its a sealed power number cs1533

[gadget73]

Explorer cam is the same in any 5.0 Explorer.

[91grandmarquis]

Ok thanks, Im going to see if I can at least get a re ground one though if I can get enough money from the cam I have.

[1987cp]

Reground? There's absolutely nothing wrong with running a used roller cam, provided it hasn't been damaged somehow. That's what makes running a factory cam economical; you can pick one up for probably $50 at the *most*.

If you're going to go to the trouble of regrinding something, these days you can probably more easily go to a custom cam grinder and have the exact cam you want for your application ground out of a quality cam blank designed for the purpose. One grinder I happen to know a (very) little about appears to be advertising his cast-core custom hydraulic rollers starting at just $300, which is scarcely more than you can pay for a lot of stock-replacement 'shafts anyway (here's everyone's beloved Mustang cam for an example), and from what I've been reading, people running his stuff report outstanding power production when and where *they* want it, combined with the level of street drivability they choose (and according to their reports, 7000rpm power and perfect streetability, and even emissions compliance, don't have to be mutually exclusive). All this means there's absolutely no point in spending actual money to run an '80s technology bumpstick in your ride.

I'm hardly the All Knowing Garbage Heap of camshafts (far from it!), but between quality off-the-shelf aftermarket cams and modern custom-cam technology, I know of no reason to regrind any SBF cam these days. To my knowledge, the whole purpose of a regrind is to get a performance camshaft when no aftermarket cores are available, such as for something weird like an MG. Besides, aside from surface-hardness issues and limitations with respect to changes in lobe centers (can't regrind a lobe where there isn't material there already), in order to obtain decent lift a regrind will have to use a (severely?) reduced lobe base circle, which will screw up your geometry on a factory roller motor and is the same feature that gives Comp's "retrofit" hydraulic rollers a bad (brittle? lol) reputation among more serious enthusiasts.

[Outlaw440]

Every time I hear people regrinding a cast cam it scares me.

Cast cams in generally scare me, since they break so easy, but I realize not everyone can afford a Billet. But if you're really willing to pay for a regrind, a billet ain't that much more...

It is your car and your money however, so do as you please.

[91grandmarquis]

Hmm ok the only reason I say that is because the one I have now is a re grind... So I assumed it would freshen it up if it had a lof of miles on it is all, But apparently there is no wear. I would like the car to have a more aggressive idle (Just a bit) You know how you can tell a car has a cam in it, but I honestly dont know the least about them and would rather have good performance than better sound. Does anyone know if there is an aftermarket cam that will yeild better performance with the gt40p heads. Im looking for torque not hp something that responds well at lower rpms to get me going. The only reason I ask is that my tax return money plus what I get for the current cam could maybe get me something better, however there are some junk explorers at the scrapyard and im sure I could get a cam out of one of those for about 30 bucks. I also know ill have to go MAF if its an aftermarket more than likely, does this mess up cruise control? I thought I heard that somewhere.

Also I know this car is never going to be a race car, but Im only doing this once so I don't want to regret anything, not because I wouldn't take it apart again but because I won't have any time once Im in college. Also if anyone has an ECU that would work with a HO swap.. Pending the cam situation.. I would be interested in that .

Thanks again for all the input.

[91waggin]

Hmm ok the only reason I say that is because the one I have now is a re grind... So I assumed it would freshen it up if it had a lof of miles on it is all, But apparently there is no wear. I would like the car to have a more aggressive idle (Just a bit) You know how you can tell a car has a cam in it, but I honestly dont know the least about them and would rather have good performance than better sound. Does anyone know if there is an aftermarket cam that will yeild better performance with the gt40p heads. Im looking for torque not hp something that responds well at lower rpms to get me going. The only reason I ask is that my tax return money plus what I get for the current cam could maybe get me something better, however there are some junk explorers at the scrapyard and im sure I could get a cam out of one of those for about 30 bucks. I also know ill have to go MAF if its an aftermarket more than likely, does this mess up cruise control? I thought I heard that somewhere.

Also I know this car is never going to be a race car, but Im only doing this once so I don't want to regret anything, not because I wouldn't take it apart again but because I won't have any time once Im in college. Also if anyone has an ECU that would work with a HO swap.. Pending the cam situation.. I would be interested in that .

Thanks again for all the input.

The stock SEFI speed density computer has integrated cruise control. If you swap it out for a mass-air computer such as can be found in a mustang (and you definitely need mass air if you want a cam with a lumpy idle--lumpy idles are not speed density friendly), you will lose cruise.

[91grandmarquis]

Ok after doing some research and finding out some stuff about MAF and more info on cams I think Im going to go with an explorer cam, especially since I will be running the gt40p heads. My next question of course is do I use an explorer computer for this setup or an HO mustang? I assume since the engine will be built like an explorer to use that computer as the speed density constraints will suite the build better, but maybe I am oversimplifying this.

[1987cp]

Keep in mind that I'm not the GMN fuelie expert, as I've basically never modded a fuelie, so take this for what it's worth ...

There is no "need to" for swapping to a mass airflow system. Some people have found that they adapt to minor hardware swaps better without having to make any actual tuning changes. Anything you might hope that system to accomplish for you can be done better by using a speed-density system and doing this little thing called "tuning". If you're not willing to do any "tuning", I suggest your keep your car pretty darn close to one factory setup or other.



Also, keep in mind that all a lumpy idle does is cost power and waste gas. How do you expect to get instant power off idle if your engine is still coughing and spluttering until 1500rpm or more? I think poor idle quality may have acquired a "performance" reputation years ago when some people were willing to put up with a lousy idle and coughing-spluttering low end if they found that the chosen low-tech off-the-shelf cam also allowed them to make big HP at high RPM with the crappy cylinder heads availble at the time. These days, and especially on an engine that will never see the high side of 4000rpm, it's pointless.

If you want something that will make semi-decent low end with factory parts (i.e. Explorer intake and GT40P heads) without having to do any homework, a $30 junkyard Exploder cam will probably be perfect for you. Wow, big surprise - Ford actually designed it to function in an emissions-controlled production vehicle alongside an Explorer intake and GT40/GT40P heads. Amazing!

[1987cp]

Ok after doing some research and finding out some stuff about MAF and more info on cams I think Im going to go with an explorer cam, especially since I will be running the gt40p heads. My next question of course is do I use an explorer computer for this setup or an HO mustang? I assume since the engine will be built like an explorer to use that computer as the speed density constraints will suite the build better, but maybe I am oversimplifying this.

If you want to use an Exploder injection system and set things up to work correctly with the camshaft position sensor and crank trigger (i.e. no distributor - gotta make any timing bumps electronically), it'd be pretty neat to see done. However, as you know, essentially everyone bases their swaps or retrofits on the Mustang system.

[91grandmarquis]

ok I see, if I use an explorer cam with an HO computer though will I be compromising anything because of the whole speed density deal?