Type F in a AOD?

[82LTDQS]

GOOD to know. Thanks smoke.

[gadget73]

Yes, because Gadget's way is the only way!

Far from it. I just try to offer people a complete and accurate picture of things. I do not like C4's. I won't tell someone they're an idiot for using one, however if someone is going to go that route, I feel they should know why they're doing it and have some reason for it. They also ought to know what they're in for so they don't get in the middle of things and have an "oh shit" moment. Also, theres no reason to get crappy with me just because you weren't happy that I used the kid card to make a possibly insensitive but rather valid point elsewhere.

How could that be? The C4 is actually somewhat more troublesome due to options for different bellhousings, different torque converter bolt patterns, lack of aftermarket governors .... and hooking up a vacuum modulator and kickdown rod is definitely a bit more annoying than a TV cable.

More people can rebuild them because they're simpler. Lots of bad AOD rebuilds out there, and they tend to cost more to overhaul. Its a big part of what gives them their bad reputation.

Wait, we have lockup converters? Thought that's just an AODE thing, I never saw anything looking even remotely like a solenoid in my valve body when I had it apart a few years back - how would a lockup converter work for us then? I never felt my trans acting like it had one either, and I know what it feels like when it engages cause I use the darn thing as a gear splitter in my diesel... Am I missing something fundamental here?

The AOD has a 2 shaft input, the outer shaft is connected to the torque converter, and works first and second gear. The inner shaft is directly attached to the converter shell, and is the input for 3 and 4. Theres a clutch system in there that actually switches which shaft the transmission input comes through, when it dies the trans doesn't shift past second gear. It doesn't lock up in the typical solenoid "extra shift" sort of way that just about everything else does, but when it shifts into third the transmission's internals are directly connected to the flexplate with no fluid coupling.

No, he's trying to tell ya that since gear ratios are the same and the C4 ain't stronger than an AOD in its stock form, it'd be a downgrade to install one in place of an AOD. Geez, why you make it such a big deal? You may be super happy with your C4, but just remember that the Chevy boys will always one-up you with them TH350s :p

Well, yea thats sort of my point about the gearing and strength. Its lighter and has a little less loss, but in a 2 ton tank, whats 10 hp and 50 lbs if it gives an overdrive gear for fuel economy? I'm not saying the AOD is THE solution for everything, but I think for a lot of situations, its probably a better solution than a C4. Each has it's place though. If one wants a 3 speed with more strength than a C4, look into the FMX. Its what the AOD is based on as far as planetary design. I'd have the same list of arguments for not using an FMX as a C4 though, primarily the lack of overdrive and lack of lockup. Also, nobody knows what an FMX is, so good luck finding performance parts or a rebuilder.


The C6 is a big trans. Stronger than the C4, but its primarily a truck and big block tranny. More power loss than the C4, same downsides, no overdrive, no lockup converter. I think it still weighs ever so slightly less than the AOD though, but its like 10 lbs or something minor.

[82LTDQS]

Good info gadget73. thank you

[82LTDQS]

Wow, thats cool about the AOD. Its not a lock up like all the others. The torque converter gets bypassed in 3rd and 4th.

[hav24wheel]

wow, i'm learning something new everyday about these AODs, i didn't know thats how the lockup converter worked on these things. I'm planning on putting a B&M shift kit (#40263)in it, but i don't know if that transgo hi-rev governor kit will work with it... Because i want a higher WOT shift and a firm shift... I'm foing a carb swap later and maybe a cam swap too. So, does any one know if that B&M shift kit will work with the transgo governor kit? Because the only transgo kit i can find for the AOD is the stick kits. not some thing i want.

[P72Ford]

Transgo makes an HP kit that you can order with the 'HI-Rev' kit. I think its like 100 or so.

[hav24wheel]

thanks i saw that, but I'm getting mixed info, on the summit site it said
Makes an automatic work like a manual.
TransGo originated shift kits, way back when. Their Stick Type kits are very specialized items that are only recommended for non-street applications, such as Pro Street, Pro Competition, and off-road. They cancel out all automatic functions in the transmission, putting you in charge of shifting. That means that you have to manually select each shift by moving the shift lever, much like with a manual transmission.

but on the transgo site it said "Firm muscle car shifts; Hold 1st, 2nd, 3rd to any rpm. Wide open 3-4 shift; Holds 4th at high speed. Includes Hi-Rev kit. (1980 to early 83 use late 83up VB)" so i might need a different VB, depending on when my car was made in 83.

So wold i have to shift manually or would it work normal with the lever in OD?

[Archangel]

That the kit you're looking at:

http://www.oregonperformancetransmission.com/Merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Store_Code=OPTI&Product_Code=TRG-AOD-HP&Category_Code=AODSK

IIRC it retains your automatic shifts, it just allows you to stay in a lower gear if you so wish as long as you want if you manually put the shifter there...

[Archangel]

The AOD has a 2 shaft input, the outer shaft is connected to the torque converter, and works first and second gear. The inner shaft is directly attached to the converter shell, and is the input for 3 and 4. Theres a clutch system in there that actually switches which shaft the transmission input comes through, when it dies the trans doesn't shift past second gear. It doesn't lock up in the typical solenoid "extra shift" sort of way that just about everything else does, but when it shifts into third the transmission's internals are directly connected to the flexplate with no fluid coupling.

Thain, so it's not a real lockup converter, but more of a bypass converter... And actually the way Ford programs the PCM-controlled transmissions is very similar, they apply the lockup solenoid almost immediately after an upshift into 3rd so the "extra shift" is felt only sometimes, and then OD and lockup are simultaneous so no extra shift felt there. Not a bad setup really, not at all.

[1987cp]

Okay, now I have a question ... if the AOD uses its lockup function only by effectively bypassing the torque converter, why do aftermarket AOD converters specify whether or not the lockup function is retained? It would seem on the surface that was complicated to accomplish ...... unless, of course, they are simply constructed so that both input shafts are driven together, all the time, and then there's slippage no matter what .... that actually sort of makes sense, come to think of it ...... :p

[Archangel]

That's just it man, there's an aftermarket setup with a single input shaft that does away with the inner shaft and therefore removes the direct-drive feature of the original design - you end up with a stronger setup, but more slippage in 3rd and OD.

[1987cp]

So the non-lockup converter is intended only to be used with a modified transmission with a single input shaft and no lockup function? Or can it also be used with a stock transmission (though I don't know why you'd want to ...)?

[hav24wheel]

That the kit you're looking at:

http://www.oregonperformancetransmission.com/Merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Store_Code=OPTI&Product_Code=TRG-AOD-HP&Category_Code=AODSK

IIRC it retains your automatic shifts, it just allows you to stay in a lower gear if you so wish as long as you want if you manually put the shifter there...

ya thats the kit..

[Archangel]

That kit should work fine for what you want, but just in case call up OPT or even TransGo and ask them if an AOD equipped with this kit will automatically shift gears if the shifter is put in OD, if their answer is yes (and it should be) then you're all good.

[hav24wheel]

Might just do that, I just picked out a cam too. 1400-5700 RPM lunati Voodoo http://store.summitracing.com/partde...K&autoview=sku