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Thread: Again, a problem with my Grand Marquis

  1. #1
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    Default Again, a problem with my Grand Marquis

    Sorry to bother you, but i've got a problem with my 1989 grand marquis LS.

    It is intermittent, sometime it works fine, sometime it wont work.

    I start the car and then when i put it in reverse or Drive, the motor stops. After it wont start. I wait 10 minutes, then it starts, i roll on the highway, and then at the first red light, the engine stops again... The starter works perfectly, in my Haines manual they say to chek the Relay...but in the 89' grand marquis, i dont find the relays(i dont think i have some).

    I think it could be a bad ground at the fuel pump, but before taking the fuel tank down, i wanted to know what you think is wrong.

    Thanks, Alex

  2. #2
    Graham: Your source for car repair and smartassery. 91waggin's Avatar
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    Sounds like a couple of different problems all happening together. When it cuts out and you say it won't start again, does the starter spin, or does nothing happen when you turn the key? If the starter is not spinning, the first thing I would check is the neutral safety switch, which might explain the fact that it won't start again until you wait awhile.

    When the motor cuts out, do you have any electrical accessories working? I know I had a similar problem, and what was causing it was a frayed wire that was creating an intermittent open circuit. This wire was running from the starter relay (round thing with wires going to positive and negative terminals on the battery) around the back of the engine bay and into the passenger compartment through a rubber boot sort of near the steering column.

    When you say the car works fine sometimes and other times not, it leads me to think electrical problems. I'm sure other people with more troubleshooting skills than I will chime in soon.
    Quote Originally Posted by gadget73 View Post
    There is nothing more permanent than a temporary fix.
    91 Mercury CP, Lopo 302, AOD, 3.08LSD. 3g upgrade, Moog wagon coils up front, cc819s in the back. KYB GR-2 police shocks. Energy suspension control arm bushings. Smog deleted.
    93 F-150 XLT, 302, Mazda 5-spd, 4wd. Stock for now
    99 Subaru Forester (wife's ride). 2.5 NA 5-spd. 95 Subaru Legacy Wagon--red--STOLEN 1/6/13

  3. #3
    Abolish the act of 1871 Lincolnmania's Avatar
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    ignition module or a bad connection somewhere.....i suggest a full tune up and all new filters if their age is unknown.

    1986 lincoln towncar signature series. 5.0 HO with thumper performance ported e7 heads, 1.7 roller rockers, warm air intake, 65mm throttle body, 1/2" intake spacer, ported intakes, 3.73 rear with trac lock, 98-02 front brake conversion, 92-97 rear disc conversion, 1" rear swaybar, 1 3/16" front swaybar, 16" wheels and tires, loud ass stereo system, badass cb, best time to date 15.94 at 87 mph. lots of mods in the works 221.8 rwhp 278 rwt
    1989 crown vic gt sedan 5.0 HO sold back to richduty455
    1991 lincoln mark VII bill blass (mini me)
    1992 mercury grand marquis, 5.0 HO conversion sold to 86vickylx
    1982 efm and 1986 alaska stokers keeping me warm

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    Jim and Angela 4 Life 87_crown_vic's Avatar
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    sounds to me as though the IAC valve is acting up and causing the stalling and the not wanting to restart might be due to a bad batter connection if stater will not turn. these cars are VERY picky about the battery connection in order to start them. my first CV would act like a dead battery and such and all i had to do was mess with where the battery cable connects to the battery to get it going.
    Addicted to 86-87 Panthers

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    Yeah, the thing is that the starter turns, but the motor wont start. Sometime it starts, but a second after, it stops.

    Thanks for your help, i didint have time to work on it, but your help is greatly appréciated.

    Alex

  6. #6
    Graham: Your source for car repair and smartassery. 91waggin's Avatar
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    Get yourself a multimeter and check your Engine Coolant Temp sensor (ECT), your throttle position sensor (TPS), and your idle air control (IAC).
    Resistance across the terminals for the ECT should be high when the engine temperature is cold, and low when it is hot.

    With the ignition on but the engine not running, the voltage drop from the +5v supply wire to the signal return wire should be between 0.2 and 1.4 volts with the throttle closed, and should be slightly lower than 4.8 at wide open throttle.

    Resistance between the IAC terminals should be between 6-13 ohms. If you don't get a reading, swap the probes around on the terminals. There's a diode that only allows current to go one way in the IAC. It probably wouldn't hurt to pull the IAC and hit it with a bunch of carb cleaner. It's more than likely gummed up.

    When you turn the ignition key to ON, but don't start the engine, you should hear a hum or whine from the rear of the car; that's the fuel pump. It'll probably shut off after a minute. If you don't hear that hum (it's pretty loud), there's something wrong with the fuel pump circuit or the pump itself. Listen for it when you're having trouble starting the car.

    Also, like Scott said, check the TFI module.

    Good luck!
    Quote Originally Posted by gadget73 View Post
    There is nothing more permanent than a temporary fix.
    91 Mercury CP, Lopo 302, AOD, 3.08LSD. 3g upgrade, Moog wagon coils up front, cc819s in the back. KYB GR-2 police shocks. Energy suspension control arm bushings. Smog deleted.
    93 F-150 XLT, 302, Mazda 5-spd, 4wd. Stock for now
    99 Subaru Forester (wife's ride). 2.5 NA 5-spd. 95 Subaru Legacy Wagon--red--STOLEN 1/6/13

  7. #7
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    Thanks, ill be on it next day off!

    Alex

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    So i checked my TPS and it is working perfectly

    I checked my ECT and the values are a bit wrong, so i'll be changing it

    Were's the Idle Air Control? I dont really know what i'm looking for, so if someone can help me locate it on my 89' grand marquis, it would be greatly appreciated.

    Thanks for your help!

  9. #9
    Graham: Your source for car repair and smartassery. 91waggin's Avatar
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    Looking at the engine from the driver's side fender....



    the red circle is the IAC (the long cylinder at the angle on the throttle body...

    and the blue circle is the TPS.
    Quote Originally Posted by gadget73 View Post
    There is nothing more permanent than a temporary fix.
    91 Mercury CP, Lopo 302, AOD, 3.08LSD. 3g upgrade, Moog wagon coils up front, cc819s in the back. KYB GR-2 police shocks. Energy suspension control arm bushings. Smog deleted.
    93 F-150 XLT, 302, Mazda 5-spd, 4wd. Stock for now
    99 Subaru Forester (wife's ride). 2.5 NA 5-spd. 95 Subaru Legacy Wagon--red--STOLEN 1/6/13

  10. #10
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    Thanks a lot for the pic 91waggin, ill test this tomorrow since its 3:39 in the morning here.

  11. #11
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    Is that the Engine Coolant Temperature sensor in pink?

    1989 Mercury Grand Marquis LS
    2007 Hyundai Accent

  12. #12
    Abolish the act of 1871 Lincolnmania's Avatar
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    no that is the air intake temp sensor......the coolant temp sensor for the ecm is near the thermostat housing

    1986 lincoln towncar signature series. 5.0 HO with thumper performance ported e7 heads, 1.7 roller rockers, warm air intake, 65mm throttle body, 1/2" intake spacer, ported intakes, 3.73 rear with trac lock, 98-02 front brake conversion, 92-97 rear disc conversion, 1" rear swaybar, 1 3/16" front swaybar, 16" wheels and tires, loud ass stereo system, badass cb, best time to date 15.94 at 87 mph. lots of mods in the works 221.8 rwhp 278 rwt
    1989 crown vic gt sedan 5.0 HO sold back to richduty455
    1991 lincoln mark VII bill blass (mini me)
    1992 mercury grand marquis, 5.0 HO conversion sold to 86vickylx
    1982 efm and 1986 alaska stokers keeping me warm

  13. #13
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    Thanks, BTW is he the singer of Twisted Sister.....STAY HUNGRY! Feel The Fire
    1989 Mercury Grand Marquis LS
    2007 Hyundai Accent

  14. #14
    Abolish the act of 1871 Lincolnmania's Avatar
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    yes that is dee snider mang

    1986 lincoln towncar signature series. 5.0 HO with thumper performance ported e7 heads, 1.7 roller rockers, warm air intake, 65mm throttle body, 1/2" intake spacer, ported intakes, 3.73 rear with trac lock, 98-02 front brake conversion, 92-97 rear disc conversion, 1" rear swaybar, 1 3/16" front swaybar, 16" wheels and tires, loud ass stereo system, badass cb, best time to date 15.94 at 87 mph. lots of mods in the works 221.8 rwhp 278 rwt
    1989 crown vic gt sedan 5.0 HO sold back to richduty455
    1991 lincoln mark VII bill blass (mini me)
    1992 mercury grand marquis, 5.0 HO conversion sold to 86vickylx
    1982 efm and 1986 alaska stokers keeping me warm

  15. #15
    Graham: Your source for car repair and smartassery. 91waggin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lincolnmania View Post
    no that is the air intake temp sensor......the coolant temp sensor for the ecm is near the thermostat housing
    The ECT is actually mounted into a house, I believe.
    Quote Originally Posted by gadget73 View Post
    There is nothing more permanent than a temporary fix.
    91 Mercury CP, Lopo 302, AOD, 3.08LSD. 3g upgrade, Moog wagon coils up front, cc819s in the back. KYB GR-2 police shocks. Energy suspension control arm bushings. Smog deleted.
    93 F-150 XLT, 302, Mazda 5-spd, 4wd. Stock for now
    99 Subaru Forester (wife's ride). 2.5 NA 5-spd. 95 Subaru Legacy Wagon--red--STOLEN 1/6/13

  16. #16
    I'm an air-conditioned gypsy gadget73's Avatar
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    no, its in a metal fitting that threads into the lower manifold. The heater hose does connect to the end of that fitting though.

    86 Lincoln Town Car (Galactica).
    Drivetrain: 5.0 HO, Explorer cam, FMS 1.72 roller rockers, 3.55 K code rear, tow package, BHPerformance ported E7 heads, Explorer intake, 65mm throttle body, Hedman 1 5/8" headers, 2.5" dual exhaust, ASP underdrive pulley, SuperCoupe stall converter

    Suspension: Bridgestone Protenza G019 225/60/16 on LSC turbines, 1 3/16" wagon front bar, 1" PI rear bar, cargo coils, KYB GR-2 front shocks, F150 rear air shocks, big front brakes, ES poly front suspension bushings, 00 CVPI steering box, ES poly body mounts, rear disc brakes

    91 Lincoln Mark VII LSC SE, triple black (Timewarp) - poly front bushings, KYB struts and shocks.

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    Member fordktpjoe's Avatar
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    Sorry to whore in the thread, but I am having some of the same issues, and trying to work them out.

    I am going to change the Ign. Module this weekend...I wonder...should I go ahead and pop for the pickup inside the distributor too? I understand you have to remove the dizzy and press the gear off, is this correct?

    I don't have a VOM to check things.

    Mine only quits after a long drive on a hot day with the A/C running, it'll just quit while I am going down the road.

    I already pulled the UIM, and cleaned the throttle body, and the EGR valve and plate, and the IAC motor, it seems to idle a bit faster too now.
    People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf. ~ George Orwell

    1990 Crown Vic, 2006 Ford Fusion, 2003 Ranger

  18. #18
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    Kind of the same thing, it is when I drive off the interstate, or if i put the pedal to the metal in my driveway and then let it go in one shot, the idle rpm seems to drop below the normal idling rpm, and a lot of times the motor then stops.

    I know my readings from my ECT is a bit under specs, so i'll be changing it...but my hopes are not that great.


    I tried to get the codes out of my OBD with my Voltmeter but I didint manage to get them. If someone got any tricks, feel free to help!

    Thanks again for everything,
    Alex
    1989 Mercury Grand Marquis LS
    2007 Hyundai Accent

  19. #19
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    Ok, here are my fault codes:

    12: RPM at idle out of range (high)
    I don't think its a big issue...but who knows?

    45: Thermactor air upstream

    My question, what is a Thermactor, what should I do? Could it be the problem? Ive never heard this name so if anyone could help me on this, ill be really glad.

    Thanks again,
    Alex
    1989 Mercury Grand Marquis LS
    2007 Hyundai Accent

  20. #20
    I'm an air-conditioned gypsy gadget73's Avatar
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    12 could be a vacuum leak, or a sticky IAC. Could also be the "idle screw" has been cranked out and the idle won't go down to normal.

    45: this is the air injection crap that runs behind the head and down to the cat converter. It ties into the smog pump. 45 means either the smog pump isn't there, isn't hooked up, the diverter valve is bad, a broken vacuum line for the diverter valve, stuck control solenoid for the valve, or most common, the ports in the cylinder heads are just packed with carbon. Don't worry about this code, it doesn't really do much of anything. The air switches away from being pumped into the back of the heads after a minute or two of running anyhow.

    86 Lincoln Town Car (Galactica).
    Drivetrain: 5.0 HO, Explorer cam, FMS 1.72 roller rockers, 3.55 K code rear, tow package, BHPerformance ported E7 heads, Explorer intake, 65mm throttle body, Hedman 1 5/8" headers, 2.5" dual exhaust, ASP underdrive pulley, SuperCoupe stall converter

    Suspension: Bridgestone Protenza G019 225/60/16 on LSC turbines, 1 3/16" wagon front bar, 1" PI rear bar, cargo coils, KYB GR-2 front shocks, F150 rear air shocks, big front brakes, ES poly front suspension bushings, 00 CVPI steering box, ES poly body mounts, rear disc brakes

    91 Lincoln Mark VII LSC SE, triple black (Timewarp) - poly front bushings, KYB struts and shocks.

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