Centrifugal. Supercharger.

[pantera77]

Adding more power should be the last thing you do. The rest of the car needs a thorough going through and upgrading before you even think about building up a decent engine.

[zoomie]

Based off of a bit of research, I can see using the XE 258 for supercharged and nitrous applications, to get further in depth in the performance side of things, my choice of heads would be the Kaase p-38 heads, as they utilize the canted valve design, other makers make them, blue thunder,brodix,yates... all excellent choices with canted valve heads, however the kaase are the cheapest that you will find, they come fully assembled , and have custom valvecovers.
For blower usage, i would use procharger or whipple, ive also found stuff they make for first gen lightnings to be of use in our panthers. for tuning i would also use microsquirt, relativly cheap and decent tuning abilities, MAF not required, If your looking at other tuning, you can also use tweecer, or moates quarter horse, there is a guy named Adam Marrer at pops racing who can tune remotely with the right setup, he also can tune speed density, which i would reccomend a mustang DA-1 ecu for ease of tuning
For the transmission there are many ways to do so, personally for an AOD id use lentech guts with hardened 300 m shaft, dirty dog 31 splien converter(he has a new one for both aod and 4r70w now), and a silver fox SPTR valve body, sus pension well, the one i had i liked very much, but turbo has a really neat setup! beef up the rear a bit add a custom or mmx driveshaft, and youll be grinnin... i think lol
.........whew thats the most ive said in a while, good luck with your endevors in performance!


YIS-Zoomie

[starkophile]

Best economy is with turbos a pair of them off a turbo Tbird or a Mecur (sp) work fine for about 550 Lbs of torq over a wide RPM range. Set up realy well might dip a box into the 10s, 12s easy and do better on economy.

Absolutely no way your getting 10 Second e.t's out of a box with a 302 and a couple small boneyard turbos.
You better have some deep pockets and some fab skills. Even of it made remotely close to the amount of power needed (which it will not) the amount of time and money needed to support the rest of the car would make it far from realistic

[starkophile]

Based off of a bit of research, I can see using the XE 258 for supercharged and nitrous applications, to get further in depth in the performance side of things, my choice of heads would be the Kaase p-38 heads, as they utilize the canted valve design, other makers make them, blue thunder,brodix,yates... all excellent choices with canted valve heads, however the kaase are the cheapest that you will find, they come fully assembled , and have custom valvecovers.
For blower usage, i would use procharger or whipple, ive also found stuff they make for first gen lightnings to be of use in our panthers. for tuning i would also use microsquirt, relativly cheap and decent tuning abilities, MAF not required, If your looking at other tuning, you can also use tweecer, or moates quarter horse, there is a guy named Adam Marrer at pops racing who can tune remotely with the right setup, he also can tune speed density, which i would reccomend a mustang DA-1 ecu for ease of tuning
For the transmission there are many ways to do so, personally for an AOD id use lentech guts with hardened 300 m shaft, dirty dog 31 splien converter(he has a new one for both aod and 4r70w now), and a silver fox SPTR valve body, sus pension well, the one i had i liked very much, but turbo has a really neat setup! beef up the rear a bit add a custom or mmx driveshaft, and youll be grinnin... i think lol
.........whew thats the most ive said in a while, good luck with your endevors in performance!


YIS-Zoomie

A pro charger setup and a Whipple are 2 completely different styles
For general ease of instalation something along the lines of a vortech novi 1000 or a paxton or a small pro charger would work and probably be the best bet. If your worried about fuel economy, might as well stop while you're ahead

Just my .02

[merc91]

yeh lol 10's in these cars will take atleast 800hp and most importantly an entire rest of the car custom build to have any hope of seeing a 10.99... 450hp/600tq (over 540tq from 2200-6000 with that sweet old nitrous) gets a 4400lb marquis high 12's with full traction and 3000rpm launch for any inquiring minds. Numerically 12 is very close to 10 but they are lightyears away at the track lol.

good info by zoomie and others suggesting hp is the last piece of the puzzle for a good car build. At 400hp the stock tranny wouldn't hold (slipped until you let off at a shift) Had a silverfox vb in my stock aod and it performed nicely bandaiding my issues nicely, have since swapped in a lentech street/strip terminator combo with 1 piece input shaft,wide ratio gearing, 1/2/3/elec OD shifting and its a really nice unit with beefed everything in it... there vb and silverfox's act exactly the same to me. If ya want the best (lentech), gota go to canada ... speaking of which, EDGE custom converters by andre over here makes excelent bullet proof stuff for good prices.
Denys driveshaft whipped me up a custom 4" aluminum driveshaft with chromoly ends/yokes, extreamely nice work and attension to detail from those guys.
Rear end needs doing, went with moser 31spline axles into a detroit locker, billet STEEL main caps, ford makes the best gears (higher ratio reduces strain on everything between the motor and pinion gear)(more stress on the goods between the ring gear to the tires)... 3.73's are king... beyond that in my case I went overkill with ford 9" ends for the 9" axle setup and willwood 4 piston disk breaks, girdle, shitload of bracework, fabbed new brackets for adjusting lower arms angle...
The car side of all 4 control arms including the arms won't hold up past 500tq long as its like stamped 16g sheetmetel acelerating a 4400lb car. bad news but if you plan on building a beast ya gotta study up big time on 4 link based suspension dynamics, cut it all out, and fabricate it all from scratch... few hrs a day... took me a yr of 6 days a week geting the entire drivetrain fabbed and perfected... but i am a perfectionist so lol. Also an airbag at 15psi in the passenger rear spring works wonders for traction.
The fuel system was good for the whopping 150hp but needs re-doing in a beast build. Bigger feed and return lines (to the rails themselves), rear tank pump feeds, bosche 044's are terrific performance/daily driver pumps, idealy duel feeding aftermarket fuel rails with dual return lines out the fronts connecting into an inline adjustable regulator with 1:1 boost/fp ratio... big injectors, bigger fuel filter to flow the extra flow while maintaining 10 micron or less filtering.
maf setups do it best when it comes to metering air.
Then ya need to moniter the vitals especially under boost with afr wideband guage, fuel press guage, boost, tranny temp (it will heat up so grab a cooler) I needed 2 with a fan on my non/lockup tranny to keep it under 195 on them slow moving hot days.
2 or 3 core rad will be needed to cool that motor.

Not trying to put a damper on things at all, just giving you a heads up on what needs to be done if building a beast. This site if fairly stuck in the "explorer cam/junkyard parts and heads..." rut, as far as performance goes there isn't much paving the way. There is a reason for that, it takes allot of money and dedication to be 1 of very few driving a reliable and good perfroming box around with 500+ in the power dept. I'm a young gun who wants that fun hp and through experience in doing it found everything listed and more was required after all in a big way.

If you are just doing a stock HO with 5psi for under 300rwhp than you can get away with a silverfox vb, tranny cooler, injecters, 255lph fuel pump, 2/3 core rad, mass air a9 stang computer, and a dyno tune with an sct chip at the least... bigger power plans and the rest needs doing.

good luck buddy

[starkophile]

The top end I posted for sale would be a solid start for a fun car. But I'll he honest I'm probably going to use the stuff since nobody seems interested

[sly]

I think the big problem is most folks here don't have much play money.

[Mr Bean]

You can run 9s. Just need LS motor and a turbo.

[pantera77]

yeh lol 10's in these cars will take atleast 800hp and most importantly an entire rest of the car custom build to have any hope of seeing a 10.99... 450hp/600tq (over 540tq from 2200-6000 with that sweet old nitrous) gets a 4400lb marquis high 12's with full traction and 3000rpm launch for any inquiring minds. Numerically 12 is very close to 10 but they are lightyears away at the track lol.

good info by zoomie and others suggesting hp is the last piece of the puzzle for a good car build. At 400hp the stock tranny wouldn't hold (slipped until you let off at a shift) Had a silverfox vb in my stock aod and it performed nicely bandaiding my issues nicely, have since swapped in a lentech street/strip terminator combo with 1 piece input shaft,wide ratio gearing, 1/2/3/elec OD shifting and its a really nice unit with beefed everything in it... there vb and silverfox's act exactly the same to me. If ya want the best (lentech), gota go to canada ... speaking of which, EDGE custom converters by andre over here makes excelent bullet proof stuff for good prices.
Denys driveshaft whipped me up a custom 4" aluminum driveshaft with chromoly ends/yokes, extreamely nice work and attension to detail from those guys.
Rear end needs doing, went with moser 31spline axles into a detroit locker, billet STEEL main caps, ford makes the best gears (higher ratio reduces strain on everything between the motor and pinion gear)(more stress on the goods between the ring gear to the tires)... 3.73's are king... beyond that in my case I went overkill with ford 9" ends for the 9" axle setup and willwood 4 piston disk breaks, girdle, shitload of bracework, fabbed new brackets for adjusting lower arms angle...
The car side of all 4 control arms including the arms won't hold up past 500tq long as its like stamped 16g sheetmetel acelerating a 4400lb car. bad news but if you plan on building a beast ya gotta study up big time on 4 link based suspension dynamics, cut it all out, and fabricate it all from scratch... few hrs a day... took me a yr of 6 days a week geting the entire drivetrain fabbed and perfected... but i am a perfectionist so lol. Also an airbag at 15psi in the passenger rear spring works wonders for traction.
The fuel system was good for the whopping 150hp but needs re-doing in a beast build. Bigger feed and return lines (to the rails themselves), rear tank pump feeds, bosche 044's are terrific performance/daily driver pumps, idealy duel feeding aftermarket fuel rails with dual return lines out the fronts connecting into an inline adjustable regulator with 1:1 boost/fp ratio... big injectors, bigger fuel filter to flow the extra flow while maintaining 10 micron or less filtering.
maf setups do it best when it comes to metering air.
Then ya need to moniter the vitals especially under boost with afr wideband guage, fuel press guage, boost, tranny temp (it will heat up so grab a cooler) I needed 2 with a fan on my non/lockup tranny to keep it under 195 on them slow moving hot days.
2 or 3 core rad will be needed to cool that motor.

Not trying to put a damper on things at all, just giving you a heads up on what needs to be done if building a beast. This site if fairly stuck in the "explorer cam/junkyard parts and heads..." rut, as far as performance goes there isn't much paving the way. There is a reason for that, it takes allot of money and dedication to be 1 of very few driving a reliable and good perfroming box around with 500+ in the power dept. I'm a young gun who wants that fun hp and through experience in doing it found everything listed and more was required after all in a big way.

If you are just doing a stock HO with 5psi for under 300rwhp than you can get away with a silverfox vb, tranny cooler, injecters, 255lph fuel pump, 2/3 core rad, mass air a9 stang computer, and a dyno tune with an sct chip at the least... bigger power plans and the rest needs doing.

good luck buddy

Cameron runs 9's with a 31 spline 8.8 and mostly stockish suspension.

Also you guys have some fat cars. My 91 wagon weighs under 4000 with me in it and it's mostly stock.

[merc91]

a stripped down 3500lb track car is allot different ofcourse but 4000+ pounder (mine being 4400) in the 12's or less needs the above... I had a super slipping tranny, bent driveshaft, 2 axles with sheared off splines and mangled control arm hookups over a 2yr span with stock stuff on a mint car with 50k miles... A ford 8.8 center section is as strong as it gets when using a differential unit, with 31spline ford 9" style axles I don't doubt it holds up to 9's as that is as strong as it gets in the ford world... thats what I built. Ford 9" centers are allot weaker due to such a small differential unit, guys running a simple spool don't have to worry about it.

Mine has an extra 100lbs sound deadening, 100 with the sound system, 60lbs nitrous systems, 60lb hitch setup welded in and 150 more with all the bracing/linelocks/pumps... and so on.
Adds up fast lol but don't wanna give up on any of the luxury stuff.

[turbo2256b]

I hammered my 69 shelby mustang putting out over 650 RWHP , 9000 RPM + SHIFTS FOR YEARS stock 9" 3.90 gears wit ha detrot locker no issues.

[merc91]

a straight locking/unlocking coged detroit locker that doesn't use prying spider gear force agaist clutches and 1300lbs less weight makes a little difference in how the diff unit holds up lol... but yes theres lots of cars running 9" rears.
If you have worked on 9" and 8.8 diff units you will understand the point being made that when building a rear end, the 8.8 center section is substancially stronger, does it mean the 9" is weak, no... just means that merc/vic people who have 8.8's don't have to go get a 9" because it's what's in car magazines and every "car guy up the road" says is best, as the 8.8 with 9" ends/axles is a stronger unit that can be handily built with the existing housing.

[turbo2256b]

The rear ends that I have most seen on the asphalt in pieces the 10 and 12 bolt Chevy and the 8.8 Ford (basicly a copy of the Chevys). As for the 9" Never seen one blow in a stock form its happened but was in a badd ass built vehicle.

The weakest links in a 8.8 are the dif bearing caps. After that the housing itself with the pressed in axle tubes dont forget the the axle end brgs riding on the axle. Add in the 9" axles / ends and all the fixes needed to fix issues of the first two sentences one could purcase a Winters quick change or basicly a 9" NASCAR rear end. I looked into it after blowing an 8.8.

[merc91]

a stock 9" is stronger than a stock 12bolt/8.8 yes, being the performance section I assumed we are going past stock stuff as there is no stock bolt in 9" rear end for our cars.

A built 8.8 with an extra 8.8 specific $275 spent (welded tubes/ 9" ends and allignment $100/MW billet steel bearing caps $125 for both even tho they say only 1 is needed, machined to fit $50) is now stronger than a comparably built/more expensive after converting to fit the car 9" because of the 9" weak link being the center section.

[piranah]

What about stepping away from the track mindset and thinking about a bulletproof highway monster? Thats what I am thinking for the Lincoln. Something that is fun from light to light but can just eat highway miles too.