PotM GrandMarq.NET - Panther Headquarters Forum Index PotM
GMN Chat Room GMN's STORE!! GMN's Gallery Please!!
Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast
Results 1 to 20 of 52

Thread: Looking for Input about Tire Safety

  1. #1
    No mean-spiritedness here. IPreferDIY's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2014
    Location
    Canada
    Posts
    1,672

    Question Looking for Input about Tire Safety

    I experienced a fairly deep tire puncture, but apparently not deep enough to cause deflation. Somewhere around 3/8 mile from home while driving relatively slow, I heard a periodic thumping sound and ultimately found something sticking out of a tire. Despite having continued home, the culprit remained at least 1/8" out from the tread surface. I used a long pair of curved needlenose pliers to pry it out, and it ended up being the pointy end of a broken 1/8" screw. (What I should have done is check for a thread and then try to unscrew it to avoid further damaging the rubber.) The pointy end would have been as deep as about 9/16" from the tread surface, which is itself ~5/32". Thankfully, the tire has not lost any pressure, and I've even been on the highway with it.

    At this point, I'm concerned about pushing my luck. At a minimum, it seems one concern is exposing the steel to moisture and inviting corrosion. Something I've thought about trying is working some rubber cement into the hole, but I doubt that would do a whole lot. Does the situation require anything more than constant monitoring?

    2000 Grand Marquis LS HPP, a hand-me-down in 2008 with 128,000 km; 175,000 km as of July 2014
    mods: air filter box "tuba" (in place of the "trumpet"), headlight relay harness, J-mod (around 186,350 km), 70mm throttle body, NKL4 PCM (from a 2000 CVPI, nothing great there apart from highway cruising), KYB Gas-A-Just shocks (after >202,000 km on originals)

  2. #2
    Beater gonna beat sly's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Lewisville, TX
    Posts
    20,897

    Default

    I'd just pay attention to the tire. If it starts leaking... patch it and go on about my day.

    Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former. -- Albert Einstein
    rides: 88 MGM (SOLD), 93 Vic, 2000 Crown Vic, 2003 Expedition
    Quote Originally Posted by gadget73
    ... and it should all work like magic and unicorns and stuff.
    Quote Originally Posted by dmccaig
    Overhead, some poor bastards are flying in airplanes.

  3. #3
    I'm an air-conditioned gypsy gadget73's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Posts
    37,511

    Default

    I'd buy a new tire and carry on my day. Once you get in that deep you risk breaking the belts and cords. Once that happens the tire gets lumpy and its done for. If money is tight and you have a real spare tire, put that on and use the punctured one as a spare until you can replace it.

    86 Lincoln Town Car (Galactica).
    5.0 HO, CompCams XE258,Scorpion 1.72 roller rockers, 3.55 K code rear, tow package, BHPerformance ported E7 heads, Tmoss Explorer intake, 65mm throttle body, Hedman 1 5/8" headers, 2.5" dual exhaust, ASP underdrive pulley

    91 Lincoln Mark VII LSC SE, triple black (Timewarp) - poly front bushings, KYB struts and shocks, Holley SystemMax1 lower intake, SilverFox AOD valve body,

    1984 Lincoln Continental TurboDiesel - rolls coal

    Quote Originally Posted by phayzer5 View Post
    I drive a Lincoln. I can't be bothered to shift like the peasants and rabble rousers

  4. #4
    No mean-spiritedness here. IPreferDIY's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2014
    Location
    Canada
    Posts
    1,672

    Default

    Ironically, I had recently gotten a mini-spare to reduce weight, and the full-size spare has been sitting in my kitchen until I do some organizing. It's on a steel rim, so it would stick out like a sore thumb, and I don't really want to add a single new one. My father got them at Costco, so I'll talk to them about preventative patching. That wouldn't address the external damage, but meh. The point on the screw was long and thin, and even that was prevented from penetrating all the way. I would guess the damage can't be any worse than ones that get plugged, so I think I'll gamble. I'll just put the full-size spare in the trunk when going on long highway trips.

    I actually missed out on two opportunities to get good tires on HPP rims for $300 in recent years. Back when I recharged my A/C, some guy who was driving by said he had the same rims as mine with new tires and asked if I was interested. As always, it would have been a matter of going deeper into debt, so I said "Probably not, unless you're practically giving them away". He said $300, but I was thinking more like $200, and I didn't bother with a counter-offer. In recent weeks, someone had a set of slightly older HPP wheels with good tires listed on Kijiji. (Those ones might have even been $275). I was tempted for many days, and then the ad was gone when I was about to inquire about them. Since mine were around 5/32" when I got a tread depth gauge last year, mine could still last for a good many years, though I'll be more inclined to pursue deals like those now.
    Last edited by IPreferDIY; 12-08-2016 at 08:01 PM.

    2000 Grand Marquis LS HPP, a hand-me-down in 2008 with 128,000 km; 175,000 km as of July 2014
    mods: air filter box "tuba" (in place of the "trumpet"), headlight relay harness, J-mod (around 186,350 km), 70mm throttle body, NKL4 PCM (from a 2000 CVPI, nothing great there apart from highway cruising), KYB Gas-A-Just shocks (after >202,000 km on originals)

  5. #5
    drink a beer, grow a beard, cut it, grind it, weld it back His Royal Ghostliness's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2015
    Posts
    3,136

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by IPreferDIY View Post
    My father got them at Costco, so I'll talk to them about preventative patching. That wouldn't address the external damage, but meh.
    Does patching an actual thru-hole address the external damage tho? Honest question, as I never thought about that till you mentioned it.
    The ones who accomplish true greatness, are the foolish who keep pressing onward.
    The ones who accomplish nothing, are the wise who know when to quit.

  6. #6
    No mean-spiritedness here. IPreferDIY's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2014
    Location
    Canada
    Posts
    1,672

    Default

    As I understand it, there are plug kits you can get for emergency/temporary purposes (I keep one in my trunk), whereas the "right" way to address a repairable thru-hole (short of replacing the tire) is to have it both plugged and patched. I have no idea if the plugging has any benefit for the inherent weakness resulting from the belts having been pierced. I wouldn't think so, and that's why I'm figuring not having a thru-hole with a patch can't be any worse than having a plug with a patch.

    2000 Grand Marquis LS HPP, a hand-me-down in 2008 with 128,000 km; 175,000 km as of July 2014
    mods: air filter box "tuba" (in place of the "trumpet"), headlight relay harness, J-mod (around 186,350 km), 70mm throttle body, NKL4 PCM (from a 2000 CVPI, nothing great there apart from highway cruising), KYB Gas-A-Just shocks (after >202,000 km on originals)

  7. #7
    Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2014
    Location
    Ohio
    Posts
    146

    Default

    After I replaced the front suspension components on the 96 Grand Marquis in July of 2015 I took the car to Midas for an alignment. All good, I take the car home. I get up in the morning and go outside and one of the rear tires is flat. Come to find a screw in it, most likely from the Midas parking lot or repair bay. In the process of taking the wheel and tire off to put on the spare, one of the studs snapped. Walked over to Advance Auto for a new stud and a patch kit. (Glad they are close. It's 1.5 miles one way and I have carried a dead battery there and back a couple of times. We also have AutoZone and Pep Boys about the same distance away in two other directions.) Anyhow, I replaced the stud and patched (plugged) the tire and it went very well. No problems with that tire anytime since and we just got rid of the car a few weeks ago because of an electrical short somewhere that refused to be tracked down.

    Those patching (plugging) kits are very good. We are moving to the west coast in March or April and I plan to take along the patch kit, a can of fix-a-flat, and the old reliable bicycle pump but probably no spare tire to take up space in the trunk.

  8. #8
    No mean-spiritedness here. IPreferDIY's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2014
    Location
    Canada
    Posts
    1,672

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by fordnmerc View Post
    ... Those patching (plugging) kits are very good. ...
    I'm no expert, but from what I've read, "patching" involves taking the tire off and putting an actual patch on the inside. So, technically, the plug kits wouldn't be called patch kits. For peace of mind, I'd definitely want to supplement a plug with a patch. It looks like Costco might do flat repairs for free for members who got their tires there, and they only charge $10.99 for members who didn't, so that's no big deal.

    2000 Grand Marquis LS HPP, a hand-me-down in 2008 with 128,000 km; 175,000 km as of July 2014
    mods: air filter box "tuba" (in place of the "trumpet"), headlight relay harness, J-mod (around 186,350 km), 70mm throttle body, NKL4 PCM (from a 2000 CVPI, nothing great there apart from highway cruising), KYB Gas-A-Just shocks (after >202,000 km on originals)

  9. #9
    I post a lot... knucklehead0202's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2015
    Location
    Southern Commiefornia
    Posts
    2,083

    Default

    Put it on the rear and do a nice, smoky burnout. That should melt the rubber sufficiently to plug any superficial hole left by a screw. Or you could stab a plug in it and most likely be fine.

  10. #10
    Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2014
    Location
    Ohio
    Posts
    146

    Default

    I guess it comes down to whatever an individual is most comfortable with. I always subscribed to the idea that a tire's best, most cohesive seal to the rim is the first time and each removal and reapplication of the tire to the rim lessens that cohesion to a degree. I also prefer to plug a hole and fill it up rather than just covering it over.

  11. #11
    No mean-spiritedness here. IPreferDIY's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2014
    Location
    Canada
    Posts
    1,672

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by knucklehead0202 View Post
    Put it on the rear and do a nice, smoky burnout. That should melt the rubber sufficiently to plug any superficial hole left by a screw. Or you could stab a plug in it and most likely be fine.
    Hehe, my first thought when I saw "burnout" was that it was Bobcat. I drive kind of like a grandpa on steroids, so no burnouts for me. I wonder if they'd be willing to do a patch on the inside along with forcing a piece of plug into the hole to try to seal it from the outside without having to poke through.

    Quote Originally Posted by fordnmerc View Post
    I guess it comes down to whatever an individual is most comfortable with. I always subscribed to the idea that a tire's best, most cohesive seal to the rim is the first time and each removal and reapplication of the tire to the rim lessens that cohesion to a degree. I also prefer to plug a hole and fill it up rather than just covering it over.
    That's an interesting point about the rim seal. I'll have to look into that. On the bright side, they use nitrogen at Costco, so that should lessen leaks.

    2000 Grand Marquis LS HPP, a hand-me-down in 2008 with 128,000 km; 175,000 km as of July 2014
    mods: air filter box "tuba" (in place of the "trumpet"), headlight relay harness, J-mod (around 186,350 km), 70mm throttle body, NKL4 PCM (from a 2000 CVPI, nothing great there apart from highway cruising), KYB Gas-A-Just shocks (after >202,000 km on originals)

  12. #12
    GMN Regular DerekTheGreat's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2014
    Location
    Warren, MI
    Posts
    5,392

    Default

    Depending on what condition the other tires are I might just replace all four. I've never been a fan or "replace two". I like my tires to match and wear evenly so four new tires & frequent rotations for me. Although I've had two tires patched/plugged. Was fine for years up until I sold it. Other one was patched some 12 years ago and never leaks, that's on my Firebird and it has withstood multiple burnouts and two extended doughnut sessions
    1985 LTD Crown Victoria - SOLD
    1988 Town Car Signature - Current Party Barge

  13. #13
    Stow It! GM_Guy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    Ontario, Canada
    Posts
    3,180

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by IPreferDIY View Post
    It's on a steel rim, so it would stick out like a sore thumb,
    It is winter in Canada, nobody is going to notice. More likely just think you are too cheap to buy 4 snow tires. =-)

    and I don't really want to add a single new one. My father got them at Costco, so I'll talk to them about preventative patching. That wouldn't address the external damage, but meh. The point on the screw was long and thin, and even that was prevented from penetrating all the way. I would guess the damage can't be any worse than ones that get plugged, so I think I'll gamble. I'll just put the full-size spare in the trunk when going on long highway trips.
    If you really want it repaired, just find a drywall screw and screw it into the hole all the way and drive to costco.

    Quote Originally Posted by IPreferDIY View Post
    As I understand it, there are plug kits you can get for emergency/temporary purposes (I keep one in my trunk), whereas the "right" way to address a repairable thru-hole (short of replacing the tire) is to have it both plugged and patched. I have no idea if the plugging has any benefit for the inherent weakness resulting from the belts having been pierced. I wouldn't think so, and that's why I'm figuring not having a thru-hole with a patch can't be any worse than having a plug with a patch.
    Plug & patch is a plug-patch (see attachment). It is one piece plug with a tail that gets pulled through the puncture. If you are going to the trouble of getting a tire repaired at a shop this is the only way to do it as it'll patch the inside, and it will seal the puncture from the elements.

    Plugs are not something you need to be scared of. Just use good ones. Rubber ones that require the use of tire cement. (vs the excessively sticky no glue required plugs). And since you mention you have a plug kit in the car, you better have an air compressor to because ain't no way you will ream the hole and plug it if the tire is actually flat. And you'll need to air up after to make up for the air that escapes. I have plugged many of my own tires, none have given me trouble.

    Alex.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails plug-patch.jpg  

  14. #14
    No mean-spiritedness here. IPreferDIY's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2014
    Location
    Canada
    Posts
    1,672

    Default

    Well, part of this thread became moot. Punctured early Wednesday, just noticeable deflation on Saturday, and getting close to completely deflated today. (I wonder if using a piece of 4x4 as a wheel chock aggravated it.) Pumped it up and went to my appointment at Costco (though they still took an hour to get to it). They say it's too close to the sidewall, and "the manager says" I need new tires since they're from 2004 and worn out (despite being 3/32" above the absolute minimum of 2/32"). I was pretty sure the screw was just inside the okay zone when I pulled it (i.e. not in the first row of tread the forms part of the corner), so I'll definitely be checking (and raising hell if they're feeding me crap).

    Considering how close it must be to the okay zone (assuming they're right), I don't see why I shouldn't try my plug kit. Does anyone think that's a bad idea? It came with a tube of rubber cement, so I'd slather a bunch on.

    I actually have one of those small compressors that you plug into the lighter or power port. I also have an up-and-down hand pump that you stabilize with your foot, as well as a regular hand-held pump, so I'm figuring I'll keep the up-and-down one in the car as a backup.

    2000 Grand Marquis LS HPP, a hand-me-down in 2008 with 128,000 km; 175,000 km as of July 2014
    mods: air filter box "tuba" (in place of the "trumpet"), headlight relay harness, J-mod (around 186,350 km), 70mm throttle body, NKL4 PCM (from a 2000 CVPI, nothing great there apart from highway cruising), KYB Gas-A-Just shocks (after >202,000 km on originals)

  15. #15
    GMN Regular DerekTheGreat's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2014
    Location
    Warren, MI
    Posts
    5,392

    Default

    I'd put four new tires on it at this point. If the Firebird got another nail that would force my hand. Since I hardly put any miles on it during season I haven't put new ones on it, plus I keep thinking I'm going to get new factory wheels or have my old ones refinished. No way I'd piss with 12 year old tires.
    1985 LTD Crown Victoria - SOLD
    1988 Town Car Signature - Current Party Barge

  16. #16
    No mean-spiritedness here. IPreferDIY's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2014
    Location
    Canada
    Posts
    1,672

    Default

    If I didn't have the timing chain tensioner stuff on my to do list, I probably would have jumped on the last set of wheels on Kijiji. Considering that the full-size spare is as old as the car (16 years) and won't be getting better with age, I'm just going to put it on the drive wheel (no Trac-Lok) until I'm ready for a new set. I'll try plugging the leaky one to keep as an emergency spare so I'm not entirely reliant on the mini-spare.

    Thanks for all the input folks!

    2000 Grand Marquis LS HPP, a hand-me-down in 2008 with 128,000 km; 175,000 km as of July 2014
    mods: air filter box "tuba" (in place of the "trumpet"), headlight relay harness, J-mod (around 186,350 km), 70mm throttle body, NKL4 PCM (from a 2000 CVPI, nothing great there apart from highway cruising), KYB Gas-A-Just shocks (after >202,000 km on originals)

  17. #17
    Stow It! GM_Guy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    Ontario, Canada
    Posts
    3,180

    Default

    Fun fact, you can still safely plug 'n patch a hole that is in the corner of the thread to sidewall. Problem is finding a shop that hasn't been paralized by legal fear. Bottom line, if it is in the thread area, it can be repaired.

  18. #18
    GMN Regular DerekTheGreat's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2014
    Location
    Warren, MI
    Posts
    5,392

    Default

    I would see no issue in running a tire that has been shielded from the elements..
    1985 LTD Crown Victoria - SOLD
    1988 Town Car Signature - Current Party Barge

  19. #19
    I post a lot...
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    Yonkers NY
    Posts
    3,862

    Default

    Well that does not always work. I once used a new spare that was 12 years old. It gave out after a couple of months. If the tires are really from 2004 then you probably want to consider replacing them anyway.

    I would take a significantly newer tire with a plug almost any day over an older tire. Also having one new tire and three old tires does not yield the best handling.

    I use plugs when I have a puncture.

    Hey Alex I had never seen those plug and patch before. Kind of cool.

    The only problems I have ever had with a patch is when the tech removed too much rubber from the inside of the tire.
    "X" car 89 Colony Park LS Mods>Engine delete, SS duals magnaflow hflow cats, 2010 Must GT mufflers, auto air shocks, Posi, Tran cooler, big front brakes, 03+ rear disks, Large 3g alt, Tripminder, GS grill, 86 seats, 16" HPP wheels, winter boots=96 Cartier wheels, 215-65/16 Goodyear ULTRA GW3 snows, pi rear sway, alum driveshaft.
    03 Marauder DBP, HS, 6disk, Organizer, Silver Stars, M&Z rear control arms, Oil deflector.
    02 SL500 Silver Arrow
    08 TC Signature Limited, HID's Mods>235/55-17 Z rated Cooper Zeon RS3-A, Addco 1" rear Sway, Posi, Compustar Remote Start, floor liners, trunk organizer, Winter=05 Mustang GT rims, Nokian Hakkapeliitta R-2 235/55-17

  20. #20
    No mean-spiritedness here. IPreferDIY's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2014
    Location
    Canada
    Posts
    1,672

    Default

    I swapped in the full-size spare last Friday. I hadn't driven my car since going to Costco about a week and a half before, and the leaky one was just showing some deflation. The full-size spare had practically no air in it when I put a mini-spare in its place in the trunk some weeks ago, and I pumped up the full-size spare to ~30 PSI at that point. I didn't bother measuring it after I put it on since I had expected the pressure to go up from the weight on it and it looked okay. I hadn't checked the other ones either since Costco had just done them when they checked the leaky one. After riding around, I measured the old ones at 38 PSI and the spare at 30 PSI. This was with a fancy dial gauge that I would presume is more accurate than my cheap stick gauge, which has been measuring lower.

    The handling seemed fine in terms of going straight, though I could feel the difference between the harshness from the old tires and the softness of the spare. Having new tires all around should make things a whole lot better. I tried pumping the spare up to 35 PSI, and that seemed to have a little bit of an adverse effect on the car going straight. Do these observations about pressure differences make sense? Ride quality isn't something I have a good feel for unless it's extreme.

    I got around to plugging the leaky one today. The hole is near the inner edge of the first row of tread, whereas I had thought it was near the outer edge of the second row of tread. I guess I have a tactile form of dyslexia. When looking closely, I could see lots of longitudinal cracks in the spaces between the rows of treads, so the old tires are definitely done. When my father gave me the car in 2008, he told me he had gotten those tires not long before, and he still thinks that, but he must be wrong.

    Interestingly, in a moment of stupidity when I hadn't realized I could not get rubber cement into a hole that has air coming out of it, some of the rubber cement got onto some of the cracks, and now it looks like the cracks are gone in that area. If I hadn't come up with a method that might keep the rest of the rubber cement from drying out in the tube, I'd be tempted to waste the rest of it on crack repair.

    To keep the opened tube of rubber cement sealed tight, I put some slightly diluted Weldbond glue around the base of the cap. I had thought about silicone, but it would have been too much of a PITA. I'm going to pick up some spare tubes of rubber cement one of these days so I know I'll have something usable if I need it, but it'll be interesting to see if the opened one stays fresh.
    Last edited by IPreferDIY; 12-25-2016 at 08:20 PM.

    2000 Grand Marquis LS HPP, a hand-me-down in 2008 with 128,000 km; 175,000 km as of July 2014
    mods: air filter box "tuba" (in place of the "trumpet"), headlight relay harness, J-mod (around 186,350 km), 70mm throttle body, NKL4 PCM (from a 2000 CVPI, nothing great there apart from highway cruising), KYB Gas-A-Just shocks (after >202,000 km on originals)

Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
GMN Approved Links!


www.rockauto.com www.adtr.net