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Thread: '79 351W Revitalisation

  1. #21

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    Quote Originally Posted by JeffBoudah View Post
    I yanked the whole cfi harness off my 84 with a 302 and just ran it with a mechanical pump, carb, and duraspark. You just need 12v start, 12v run, and ballast resisted run voltage for the coil. Easy peazy. You also dont need to worry about a TV throttle linkage making it even easier, since your 79 is a c4 car.
    Oddly enough, the manual doesn't specify a C-4 at all, but either a FMX or C-6. And apparently checking the dipstick about the required fluid will supposedly answer the question of which, if the manual is completely accurate.

  2. #22

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    Quote Originally Posted by Brown_Muscle View Post
    Rip all that out- if you want to go a step farther rip the smog stuff out and plug the back of the heads with bolts. You can just turn the module into DS-II as gadget said and the dizzy/module will work just fine. You can get a remanned 2150 off rockauto. Just make sure it has the linkage for the TV rod. I suggest trying to find a 2150 with the larger venturi size if you can (1.23 I believe, or 1.21??)

    You can try to make the existing system run with a replacement- but it will not be as reliable as a 2150 and a good old DS-II system, at least not with everything aged as it has
    I'll be getting a rebuilt 2150 for $40 later this week from someone in the local Panther community. As for the smog stuff, yeah, I want to pull it out, open some space under the hood. If the thermactor holes are the same size and thread as those in the 351M/400 heads, I may be good. I bought new thermactor plugs for my LTD because I thought one was missing, but I never used them because it turned out my missing plug wasn't missing, it was just partially disintegrated. I ended up just plugging the port with some JB Weld SteelStik. Been holding up for a couple years now.

  3. #23

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rodentkiller View Post
    If you want to go the way of rebuilding the VV contact Nathen in Min he did it in his College Dorm room and got his car to run right just a suggestion.
    I'm not sure I will. There are a lot of related sensors and such of which I cannot seem to locate replacements. If they're bad or go bad, a rebuilt VV carb won't do me much good, so it seems like rolling back away from this transitional technology would be for the best. But thanks for the mention of who could be helpful.

  4. #24
    I'm an air-conditioned gypsy gadget73's Avatar
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    Probably an FMX. The C6 was the heavy duty trans that mostly got used in trucks and behind big blocks. Me, I'd swap that for a late AOD and put in a not-stupid ratio diff. Its probably got something in the 2.26 range to try and make fuel economy without overdrive.

    86 Lincoln Town Car (Galactica).
    5.0 HO, CompCams XE258,Scorpion 1.72 roller rockers, 3.55 K code rear, tow package, BHPerformance ported E7 heads, Tmoss Explorer intake, 65mm throttle body, Hedman 1 5/8" headers, 2.5" dual exhaust, ASP underdrive pulley

    91 Lincoln Mark VII LSC SE, triple black (Timewarp) - poly front bushings, KYB struts and shocks, Holley SystemMax1 lower intake, SilverFox AOD valve body,

    1984 Lincoln Continental TurboDiesel - rolls coal

    Quote Originally Posted by phayzer5 View Post
    I drive a Lincoln. I can't be bothered to shift like the peasants and rabble rousers

  5. #25
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    maybe only 302 cars got a c4 for 79? I know I pulled a c4 out of my 79 tudor. If you just glance under... cast iron case it's an FMX, if your bellhousing is a part of the case you have a c6, if it's all aluminum with a bellhousing that comes off the case it's a c4.

  6. #26

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    I took a look at the dipstick, and it indicates Type F fluid, which according to the manual excludes the C-6. And if it's anything like my LTD, then yeah, the C-4 was relegated to the 302. So, likely the FMX. Also doesn't look like anything different from my LTD in terms of linkages between the carb and trans, very similar throttle connections (only difference I see is how the cruise control connects, but it has the same type of connection to the throttle overall), so the 2150 should be an easy bolt-on swap without any worry about TV cables.

    Sent from my VS988 using Tapatalk

  7. #27
    fomoco panthers !
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    My 1979 LTD S with the 351 had a C-4 ! I could not believe it. I thought it would have been a FMX. Nope, C-4
    That car was very odd. Originally a Avis rental car out of Los Angeles. Did the airport, Disneyland and tourist trap route.
    Last edited by Mainemantom; 12-04-2019 at 12:42 AM.

  8. #28

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    Quote Originally Posted by gadget73 View Post
    Probably an FMX. The C6 was the heavy duty trans that mostly got used in trucks and behind big blocks. Me, I'd swap that for a late AOD and put in a not-stupid ratio diff. Its probably got something in the 2.26 range to try and make fuel economy without overdrive.
    I think they used the C-6 in this car if it came with a towing package from the factory, based on the manual info. Ultimately I think I might end up putting a C-6 into it somewhere down the road, unless I can get an AOD that can handle abuse as well as the C-6. I have plans for power under the hood, but I'll get that all figured out somewhere after I get it back into running condition. And after I get things squared away with my wagon and truck.

  9. #29
    I'm an air-conditioned gypsy gadget73's Avatar
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    I've never been much on the C- transmissions. Slushy shifts, not enough gears, and the C6 especially is a power pig. The AOD is plenty strong if its built correctly, stock they're a bit blah.

    86 Lincoln Town Car (Galactica).
    5.0 HO, CompCams XE258,Scorpion 1.72 roller rockers, 3.55 K code rear, tow package, BHPerformance ported E7 heads, Tmoss Explorer intake, 65mm throttle body, Hedman 1 5/8" headers, 2.5" dual exhaust, ASP underdrive pulley

    91 Lincoln Mark VII LSC SE, triple black (Timewarp) - poly front bushings, KYB struts and shocks, Holley SystemMax1 lower intake, SilverFox AOD valve body,

    1984 Lincoln Continental TurboDiesel - rolls coal

    Quote Originally Posted by phayzer5 View Post
    I drive a Lincoln. I can't be bothered to shift like the peasants and rabble rousers

  10. #30

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    Quote Originally Posted by gadget73 View Post
    I've never been much on the C- transmissions. Slushy shifts, not enough gears, and the C6 especially is a power pig. The AOD is plenty strong if its built correctly, stock they're a bit blah.
    If I were to go the C-6 route, I'd be getting something that tweaked up for performance applications, not stock. But at this time it's really just musings. I'm definitely going that route with my wagon, but that's a whole different can of worms altogether. It's getting a fully matched drivetrain for a version built with the class III tow package.

    Sent from my VS988 using Tapatalk

  11. #31

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    Ok, so I was poking around on eBay because my guy can't find the 2150 he thought he had on hand. He thinks he may have accidentally left it in one of the cars he's gotten rid of over the last year. Anyway...

    I saw this particular option, but wasn't sure it was a good idea:

    https://rover.ebay.com/rover/0/0/0?m...2F173720731806

    Maybe good enough for a while until I give that Windsor the ol' 4bbl treatment?

    Sent from my VS988 using Tapatalk

  12. #32
    I'm an air-conditioned gypsy gadget73's Avatar
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    don't see why that wouldn't work. Looks like they spec it for 289, 302 and 351, possible you can get a smooch more power out of it with larger main jets but it should run well enough as-is. You can do some plug reads to see if it needs more main jet. Just make sure the lever looks like yours with the proper connections for the kickdown rod and the throttle linkage. Probably would benefit from some distributor re-curving as well. The stock stuff tends to be overly conservative for emissions reasons, but if you let it pull more timing earlier it should make it suck less. Its not a particularly high compression engine so it will suffer a fair bit of timing without any BS as long as the fuel mix isn't too lean.

    86 Lincoln Town Car (Galactica).
    5.0 HO, CompCams XE258,Scorpion 1.72 roller rockers, 3.55 K code rear, tow package, BHPerformance ported E7 heads, Tmoss Explorer intake, 65mm throttle body, Hedman 1 5/8" headers, 2.5" dual exhaust, ASP underdrive pulley

    91 Lincoln Mark VII LSC SE, triple black (Timewarp) - poly front bushings, KYB struts and shocks, Holley SystemMax1 lower intake, SilverFox AOD valve body,

    1984 Lincoln Continental TurboDiesel - rolls coal

    Quote Originally Posted by phayzer5 View Post
    I drive a Lincoln. I can't be bothered to shift like the peasants and rabble rousers

  13. #33

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    Quote Originally Posted by gadget73 View Post
    don't see why that wouldn't work. Looks like they spec it for 289, 302 and 351, possible you can get a smooch more power out of it with larger main jets but it should run well enough as-is. You can do some plug reads to see if it needs more main jet. Just make sure the lever looks like yours with the proper connections for the kickdown rod and the throttle linkage. Probably would benefit from some distributor re-curving as well. The stock stuff tends to be overly conservative for emissions reasons, but if you let it pull more timing earlier it should make it suck less. Its not a particularly high compression engine so it will suffer a fair bit of timing without any BS as long as the fuel mix isn't too lean.
    For the most part right now I'm just wanting to get it running again. And best that I can tell, the lever looks close enough. The throttle and cruise control connect to the same link that connects to the ball socket on the lever. I figured this seemed like a good cost effective item to get it running.

    Sent from my VS988 using Tapatalk

  14. #34
    P31 Pursuit Car Brown_Muscle's Avatar
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    So my buddy bought one of those cheap eBay carbs. Itís unbelievable how inexpensive they are. We got his truck running with it, however itís not drivable so I canít say for sure how good it is. I will say the engine runs with it and revs up

  15. #35

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    Ok, so the 7200 looks to have a fully electric choke, and this 2150 has an electric assisted choke. Would this be an appropriate part to install onto the 2150 to bring it to full electric?

    https://carbkitsource.com/chokes/cc028.html

    Also, what would be the best way to block off the heated air inlet on the choke?

    Sent from my VS988 using Tapatalk

  16. #36
    Wagon Addicted Tiggie's Avatar
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    I was under the impression that the choke thermostats were either 100% electric or 100% heat activated. But your car has already made me learn a few new things, so I am learning each day.

    There are several different choke thermostats available. I think many of the Ford Product ones from 1960ish-1990ish are the same size. The tang design on the carbs changed a little - check your current 2150 choke thermostat and find an 2150 application electric thermostat with the same design and it should work for you. Some like a full 12V key on, and some like output from the stator of the alternator at a lesser voltage. Check the output of your wire with the car running. Generally, anything with a Ford 1G alternator will like the stator output.

    On the carb choke, you can run with the heat riser connection disconnected no problem. Stuff a cork in it if you want, or if itís threaded you can just get a threaded cap and screw onto it to keep the bugs and crap out.
    Last edited by Tiggie; 01-02-2020 at 08:12 AM.
    1988 Crown Vic Wagon - daily
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  17. #37

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    If I'm understanding the choke configurations correctly, even if they fit the same, you can't swap an electric choke from an electric-assist to full electric. The electric-assist version heats less because it has warm/hot air as well, whereas the full electric generates more heat. I could probably swap the choke from the 7200 to the 2150, but it seems better to get a new choke. Just not sure if the part that I found is full electric or electric-assist.

    As for the hot air inlet, unless someone happens to know the size and thread, I suppose that I can just wander on over to a hardware store with it and see what fits. Can probably seal it up sufficiently with some Teflon pipe tape.

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  18. #38
    P31 Pursuit Car Brown_Muscle's Avatar
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    When I had my 2150, I just left it open. I believe originally I had a piece of rubber hose threaded onto it getting it closer to the headers. In either configuration the choke ended up opening just fine

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