My 1987 Two Door Crown Victoria AKA THE BROWN BLOB

[87gtVIC]

I like your style, Dude.

Why not let people ride in the back? Townies did get the reading lights back there with their own switch but so did Cadillac Broughams, only it was an option for those. I always thought the seat flood lights are silly, then again I suppose they help with finding stuff that has fallen on the floor should that happen. I just think the door lights like Cadillac had would be a nice touch. Ford eventually got the hint as '90 and up had them. Why they took many more years to illuminate the door controls and other switches is a mystery..

As for the speedo, weren't Digidash townies equipped with an electronic speed sensor as well as a cable? Or aren't they all? Perhaps you could use that signal for a digital speedometer? I think GM GMT400 trucks 92 and up have independent DRAC modules which could be retrofitted to suit your needs.



Door lights. Lincolns are supposed to be fancy pants & swanky.

I don't want anyone climbing in ruining stuff attempting to get in the back.

Speedo is staying analog. I LOVE the 140 speedo.

David, get rid of those damn seats!!!!

I get it, if you were conceived on them, that's one thing! But cmon!

Maybe one day. I'd actually like to learn/delve with upholstry and add some...a lot of bulsters to them and make them look sporty. Never gonna happen but its an idea.

Lincolns had rear map lights controlled with a switch on each rear door. What else do you need?

To find them now. lol Well actually, just look at how they look and decide if it wold be worth popping them into the rear two door specific c pillar panels. Thats a tough decision.

I see you used a special too for the rivet nuts. Can they be installed with a regular pop rivet tool?

Like Thain said. This is its own special tool.

[DerekTheGreat]

I don't want anyone climbing in ruining stuff attempting to get in the back.

Speedo is staying analog. I LOVE the 140 speedo.

To find them now. lol Well actually, just look at how they look and decide if it wold be worth popping them into the rear two door specific c pillar panels. Thats a tough decision.

Valid concern. I have an approved list for the Firebird & Fury. Well the fury is pretty raggedy so I don't care about that haha.

I prefer analog speedo's too. What I was thinking was you could have the analog look but use a digital signal, like Mark VII's use, late model F-body cars and GMT series trucks. No bouncy bounce.

The reading lights townies have are pretty swank, maybe I'll post a pic of mine. Rag top cars got a different one, they have an aftermarket look to them but might be easier to retrofit into your car.

[His Royal Ghostliness]

Why not let people ride in the back?

People are generally slobs. Some tend to care about their own interiors (I've been told that I have the filthiest yet the cleanest truck the person has ever seen, mud and dirt and dust up to the windows on the outside yet inside so clean one could perform surgery without risk of infection), and by extension about other people's vehicles, but most just DGAF for either.

I always thought the seat flood lights are silly, then again I suppose they help with finding stuff that has fallen on the floor should that happen..

I like the floor pan lighting quite a bit, enough to add such on my trucks. It is however red, and is tied into the dash lights, and is therefore on all the time during night-time driving but it also dims with the rest of the dash. It's a great help when trying to find my cat who has the habit of laying under the pedals

As for the speedo, weren't Digidash townies equipped with an electronic speed sensor as well as a cable? Or aren't they all? Perhaps you could use that signal for a digital speedometer?

Everything that is EEC-IV and has vacuum-based cruise control AND mechanical-drive speedometer uses that dual-feature VSS, trucks and vans included. The cable runs the the speedometer gauge, the electric part of the VSS is for the cruise. If the vehicle has electronic gauge cluster the cable portion of the VSS will simply be capped off from the factory.

I get it, if you were conceived on them, that's one thing!

Now this here guy gets it! LMAO

[sly]

I see you used a special too for the rivet nuts. Can they be installed with a regular pop rivet tool?

They can be installed with a quality screw and a little lube on a washer or 2. The tool of course is better.

[DerekTheGreat]

People are generally slobs. Some tend to care about their own interiors (I've been told that I have the filthiest yet the cleanest truck the person has ever seen, mud and dirt and dust up to the windows on the outside yet inside so clean one could perform surgery without risk of infection), and by extension about other people's vehicles, but most just DGAF for either.

This is how my cars are, well the ones that don't have the fortune of living in a garage. I like my interiors to be minty fresh.

I like the floor pan lighting quite a bit, enough to add such on my trucks. It is however red, and is tied into the dash lights, and is therefore on all the time during night-time driving but it also dims with the rest of the dash. It's a great help when trying to find my cat who has the habit of laying under the pedals

You have a car cat? Underseat lighting isn't noticeable so much on Ashley's TC as it is mine, the darker interior hides the light quite a bit. I like lights. I might almost not buy a pickup truck if it doesn't have the clearance lights...

Everything that is EEC-IV and has vacuum-based cruise control AND mechanical-drive speedometer uses that dual-feature VSS, trucks and vans included. The cable runs the the speedometer gauge, the electric part of the VSS is for the cruise. If the vehicle has electronic gauge cluster the cable portion of the VSS will simply be capped off from the factory.

Oh, so sounds like one could use that VSS signal. I thought our cars were hybrids but I've never looked at where the cable comes out of the trans. Kinda silly really, seems like it would also cost more to do things that way. At least with GMT trucks (Since I've futzed with those) they use a speed sensor that feeds the cluster then the ECM and also with their temp gauge they've got one sending unit for that, unlike Ford's stuff.

[His Royal Ghostliness]

I have a cat, not necessarily a car cat - she's just forced to come along for the ride, something she's quite vocal in expressing her disapproval of.

OBS and older trucks do not have underdash lighting, and certainly not one that dims with the gauge cluster and stuff - you got one of them disasterpieces, you ought ti know that. If you like them courtesy lights than add yourself some, tap the juice right off the instrument cluster lighting fuse.

The cable-drive speedometer came about long before the electronic one, Ford just kept running what's been around for a long while already and added the electric signal generator on top of it - valid design/solution in my book. Your OBS POS runs the rear axle sensor for everything, but it still needs the PSOM to translate the signal into something the PCM and the cruise brain can understand.

[DerekTheGreat]

I had one experience of having a cat in the car, was not pleasant. Lots of meowing and clawing.

Yes, yes they do have underdash lighting Part of the light group of options which included the underhood light as well as the underhood work light. They aren't tied into the dash lights though, they come on when you open the door. GMT400's aren't so bad, we initially thought so but it's just like any other car we've owned; once you bond with it and learn about it's weak spots you're that much better at spotting them and fixing them. With us though it seems most people don't maintain their vehicles so they're all busted up by the time they get to us and need love, lots of it. I was talking about clearance lights, the ones on the roof. Won't add those, just cool to see on trucks 3/4 ton and up.

OBS truck runs the trans sensor for everything. Not sure if it makes a difference to have a sensor in the rear end to detect wheel speed for the RABS or not; these trucks seem more sensitive than the Ferds we have. That's another thing too, the Cruise is all electronic on these too. A lot less vacuum bullshittery to worry about. I like my GM POS trucks as much as I like my Ford POS trucks.

[His Royal Ghostliness]

I was talking about clearance lights, the ones on the roof. Won't add those, just cool to see on trucks 3/4 ton and up.

Yeah fuck those, yeah they look cool but they also let water in cause the damn roof skin they're bolted onto is so thin with zero bracing under it that it bends outta shape if you so much as look at it the wrong way.

OBS truck runs the trans sensor for everything.

Right, only problem with that is OBS trucks do NOT have a transmission sensor at all! VSS on the rear axle is the one that runs everything, and ironically the only thing that an use its signal directly is the RABS - everything else needs signal of the form the transmission sensor was putting out, so some translating device is needed. Enter the PSOM, aka your speedometer module - it does more than just show the speed and count the miles, and thus when it fucks up everything downstream from it fucks up as well.

All this became a massive offtopic for this thread now tho, we should probably put an end to it...

[DerekTheGreat]

Same holds true for the cargo light. I like those too but the gaskets dry rot and let water in. Bye bye rocker panels and cab corners. I still want my cargo light though! Like 'em. Our GMC C3500 didn't leak around it's clearance lights, guess we got lucky with that truck. You don't see many Fords with them at all though. Odd.

Are you talking about Ford OBS trucks? I have no personal experience with GM trucks beyond '89. Our 88 and this new 89 both only have a sensor in the transmission, nothing on the axle. I suppose they were dicked with after '94 as that's when they got rid of the electrical bulkhead on the passenger side firewall and added Kelsey-Hayes 4 wheel abs.

Probably, only if David gets pissed. Can't see him ever owning a GM truck...

[87gtVIC]

Its all good. lol

[His Royal Ghostliness]

Its all good. lol

Well, in that case...

Same holds true for the cargo light. I like those too but the gaskets dry rot and let water in. Bye bye rocker panels and cab corners. I still want my cargo light though! Like 'em. Our GMC C3500 didn't leak around it's clearance lights, guess we got lucky with that truck. You don't see many Fords with them at all though. Odd.

Every dually Ford should have those lights, federal requirement for vehicles over 80" wide. For SRW trucks they were optional, and probably not very cheap tho. That said I've seen decent number of SRW trucks with them, tho it's anyone's guess how many of them were actually factory-equipped as such. As for cargo lights, I like them as well, what I don't like is how they're tied into the dome light so when you turn the cargo light on the dome lights up as well - can't see shit out the window then. Mine get separated for that reason, the dome remains open-door powered, and the cargo is off the switch. But I also got map lights so I can get interior lighting without having the door open or messing with the switch on the dash.

Are you talking about Ford OBS trucks? I have no personal experience with GM trucks beyond '89. Our 88 and this new 89 both only have a sensor in the transmission, nothing on the axle.

Well yeah, ain't that what you got, a Fors OBS? Those run everything off the rear axle VSS, earlier bricks split duties between axle for RABS and transmission for everything else, and the previous generation (bullnoses) don't have an axle VSS cause no RABS back then. And funny you should mention the 4WAL, with Ford only Broncos and maybe some halftons got that, and it was still pretty rare. On a 3/4-ton and larger, ain't happening. Hell many (if not all) of the F-Superduties(model above F350) didn't have RABS even, justa straight line from the master back to the axle, they did have the mechanical brake bias valve there that ties to the axle tho, so at least there was something.

[87gtVIC]

Yeah.....




These fuckers are big.

Gonna have to run new traces for the left hand turn signal indicator as well as the left side lower illumination light.

Gauges will get their power/ground through the same wires as before (from the cluster) but now will be tapped into the harness instead of tapped off the printer circuit. The gauges are SO deep that I will run the wiring to them from the cars harness the behind the plastic and out the holes in the dash that were originally cut to allow the shallow sunpro gauges illumination bulbs to fit. Yeah much fun. Same goes for the sender wires and illumination wires for these two fat ass gauges.

Will work out just as good in the end really.

In past it was just popping off the harness from the back of the gauge cluster.

Now I will have to do that then pull out the harnesses for the H20 gauge and PSI gauge and then disconnect those.

No biggie.

To be honest the new gauges use spade terminals so it works out fine in this situation. If they were nuts on posts like before i'd then be pissed.


Next up before any of that gets touched upon will be making the brackets to hold the gauges to the cluster.

After that I will solder back in the two leads for the LOW FUEL light and then work out the illumination bulb and left hand turn signal indicator. Then the fun inside the car will begin. Little nip tuck and we will be golden?

[DerekTheGreat]

Well, in that case...


Every dually Ford should have those lights, federal requirement for vehicles over 80" wide. For SRW trucks they were optional, and probably not very cheap tho. That said I've seen decent number of SRW trucks with them, tho it's anyone's guess how many of them were actually factory-equipped as such. As for cargo lights, I like them as well, what I don't like is how they're tied into the dome light so when you turn the cargo light on the dome lights up as well - can't see shit out the window then. Mine get separated for that reason, the dome remains open-door powered, and the cargo is off the switch. But I also got map lights so I can get interior lighting without having the door open or messing with the switch on the dash.


Well yeah, ain't that what you got, a Fors OBS? Those run everything off the rear axle VSS, earlier bricks split duties between axle for RABS and transmission for everything else, and the previous generation (bullnoses) don't have an axle VSS cause no RABS back then. And funny you should mention the 4WAL, with Ford only Broncos and maybe some halftons got that, and it was still pretty rare. On a 3/4-ton and larger, ain't happening. Hell many (if not all) of the F-Superduties(model above F350) didn't have RABS even, justa straight line from the master back to the axle, they did have the mechanical brake bias valve there that ties to the axle tho, so at least there was something.

I never thought about running the cargo light separate, I never liked how they are tied in with the interior lights either. On GMT400 trucks they have a switch for the cab light; I'm guessing the juice all goes through that switch and that the ground is tied into the door ajar switch. So if I'm right I could disconnect the ground that ties in the with door/dimmer switch, run another one and then disconnect the lead from the dimmer switch so it only pops on when I want it to.

We have a '92 F-250 and an '89 K1500 now. I would rather we had an '87-91 F-series truck. I like the look & interior of those better. If I had to have a 92-97 F250 I'd want a 96 or 97 since they were mass air. Wouldn't even mind a 351 as they should be rolly blocks. The K1500 only has the trans sensor.. I haven't looked at the '92's trans but I'm assuming it uses a speedo cable still? Not even sure if I saw a connector going into the diff for RABS. Which while the truck has the light in the dash, I've locked the rears up enough to know it doesn't work, almost like it's on a timer to shut off after 2 seconds.

David, do you have any pics of the cluster in mock-up phase? Curious to see what it will look like from the other side.

[DerekTheGreat]

Oh, here are a few pics of the reading lights Townies got in the back..

[His Royal Ghostliness]

Good grief that's a lot of wok on that cluster! But it is what it is, if there ain't no other way to get it how you want it you gotta endure... (says the guy with solid week's worth of wiring aux switches and relays and shit). Dumb question/concern, but if the gauges are so deep, and they have spade terminals sticking out the back, do double-check depth availability in the dash there - you need at least 1/2" on top of combined gauge+cluster thickness for the spade connectors and the wires. May also be a good idea to use right-angle spade connectors, if it will allow for wiring to be tidier.

Derek, the Ford trucks have a diode tying the dome land the cargo lights together, basically the door jamb switches power the dome light only and the big main switch on the dash actually powers the cargo light which then powers the dome light via said diode - flip the diode around you get the opposite effect, take it out entirely and you got fully separate lights but again in that case the dome light will only come on if doors are open. '92-up trucks are all electronic speedometers with no cable drive, the only VSS is on the axle. '96 and '97 F250s with the 351 are not MAF unless it's a Cali-emissions truck.