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Stainless Exhaust Flanges Rotting Away: What Does the Future Hold? - Page 2
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Thread: Stainless Exhaust Flanges Rotting Away: What Does the Future Hold?

  1. #21
    Stow It! GM_Guy's Avatar
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    If you think you will find an exhaust shop that does that, well, good luck to ya.

    Alex.

  2. #22
    Goal was 'giving back', done by 2020.
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    A more significant issue for me is if one shop thinks they can charge an extra $40 without doing anything extra, then no thanks. It could be that the lesser-quality weld is not significant in our particular application, but that's beyond me at this point.

    2000 Grand Marquis LS HPP, a hand-me-down in 2008 with 128,000 km; 175,000 km as of July 2014
    mods: air filter box 'tuba', headlight relay harness, J-mod (around 186,350 km), 70mm throttle body, KYB Gas-A-Just shocks, aluminum driveshaft, ARA3 PCM

  3. #23
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    I had a chat about this with my father, who has experience welding stainless for food industry applications. Apparently back-purging is only an issue for butt connections, in which case the weaker weld and reduced corrosion protection from no back-purging would be a concern. If there is an overlap, then back-purging isn't really an issue. I'm not suggesting this must be right but rather just adding it to the mix.

    It seems the vast majority of stainless flanges do not have any kind of protrustion for a butt weld, so I guess they're intended for an 'overlap' weld, like so:

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    I would also guess the folks who weld in pieces of pipe are probably doing sleeves for overlap welds rather than butt welds. This makes sense, since getting butt welds aligned with small enough gaps would seem exceedingly difficult, and it's hard to imagine shops knowingly doing weaker welds. OTOH, I'm having a hard time justifying $160 for welding on a couple of sleeves (even if $200 for the flanges might still not be so bad).

    2000 Grand Marquis LS HPP, a hand-me-down in 2008 with 128,000 km; 175,000 km as of July 2014
    mods: air filter box 'tuba', headlight relay harness, J-mod (around 186,350 km), 70mm throttle body, KYB Gas-A-Just shocks, aluminum driveshaft, ARA3 PCM

  4. #24
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    You are overthinking it. They are just flanges. You are not building Titanic here.

  5. #25
    Goal was 'giving back', done by 2020.
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    Maybe you can afford to throw $200 at something without regard to whether it will last for two years or 10+, but I can't. And given that no one here seems to have any expertise in this area, maybe others would find it interesting.

    2000 Grand Marquis LS HPP, a hand-me-down in 2008 with 128,000 km; 175,000 km as of July 2014
    mods: air filter box 'tuba', headlight relay harness, J-mod (around 186,350 km), 70mm throttle body, KYB Gas-A-Just shocks, aluminum driveshaft, ARA3 PCM

  6. #26
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    While I appreciate the fact you want something done right, its an exhaust system with thin walled pipe, not a food processing plant or refinery with heavier pipe, and are more precisely laid out. Its an exhuast system that mostly fits together and gets welded or clamped. Butt welded gaps with excess gap get filled with more filler rod. You get them as close as possible then close them up.
    You dad a mobile welder? Go pay a visit and have him weld it up.

  7. #27
    Goal was 'giving back', done by 2020.
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    Quote Originally Posted by GM_Guy View Post
    ...
    You dad a mobile welder? Go pay a visit and have him weld it up.
    Do you really think this thread would have gotten to this point if that was the case?

    For those who would rather just pay someone to do it and not worry about the finer points of welding, do what you like, but why blow off anything more than the most superficial understanding of welding as something not worthy of understanding? I'd love to learn to weld, not only for messing around with stuff, but also as an interesting supplement to my science background. I would certainly do the flanges myself if I was in a position to do so. One concern is whether a shop would actually disconnect the battery during welding, which should be done to protect the electronics. With my luck, I'd end up with someone who either doesn't know, doesn't give it any thought, or just doesn't bother.

    I managed to stop by Mufflerman two hours before closing time yesterday (traffic was nasty), but they seemed rather busy and probably would not have been able to get to me even if they were not the type of place that only puts in pieces of pipe. Their “ballpark” estimate for pieces of pipe was $200. So much for lower prices outside the GTA. It's probably been about two decades since I had work done at Zoro, and they win again.

    2000 Grand Marquis LS HPP, a hand-me-down in 2008 with 128,000 km; 175,000 km as of July 2014
    mods: air filter box 'tuba', headlight relay harness, J-mod (around 186,350 km), 70mm throttle body, KYB Gas-A-Just shocks, aluminum driveshaft, ARA3 PCM

  8. #28
    Goal was 'giving back', done by 2020.
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    Finally got this done at Zoro. $200 plus taxes. After all the lead-up, it went really quick. Before I went wandering around, the guy said it would take about half hour. So if it's a typical $100/hr shop rate, there must be a pretty hefty profit.

    I figured I would be nice and provide the right wrenches for the flange bolts I used and the right socket on my ratchet for the battery cable, plus some antiseize for the new hardware. I happened to have a computer power supply box that I didn't need and used that. I was also wanting to get the old parts back but didn't get around to mentioning that. The guy pointed out he had a toolbox with the necessary tools, as if I had done something foolish.

    By the time I got back, the guy had gone for lunch or whatever, and he hadn't put the old parts in the box. It turns out that he hadn't disconnected the flanges at all but rather just cut maybe an inch or so on either side of them and dropped them in the trash can. Whatever. At least it's done, and there is a noticeable difference while driving. I noticed a vibration while stopped or close to stopped at certain points, and I would guess the weights would dampen that if I put them back on, but meh.

    The Costco in that part of Mississauga has a self-serve checkout at one end, so I guess they'll be offering that in other locations soon.

    2000 Grand Marquis LS HPP, a hand-me-down in 2008 with 128,000 km; 175,000 km as of July 2014
    mods: air filter box 'tuba', headlight relay harness, J-mod (around 186,350 km), 70mm throttle body, KYB Gas-A-Just shocks, aluminum driveshaft, ARA3 PCM

  9. #29
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    I was hoping I wouldn't have further exhaust issues, but the hardware holding the passenger side cat to the exhaust manifold rotted away enough for the cat to drop a bit. Got new hardware put in for $150 plus taxes at Zoro without bothering to call around. I'm figuring the other side should be fine for at least 1-3 more years.

    Here's a pic of the H-pipe flanges:

    Click image for larger version. 

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    Apparently their flanges rotate on the stubs before installation and get welded once aligned.

    2000 Grand Marquis LS HPP, a hand-me-down in 2008 with 128,000 km; 175,000 km as of July 2014
    mods: air filter box 'tuba', headlight relay harness, J-mod (around 186,350 km), 70mm throttle body, KYB Gas-A-Just shocks, aluminum driveshaft, ARA3 PCM

  10. #30
    Goal was 'giving back', done by 2020.
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    Something possibly worth noting is that while I dozed in the waiting area for a couple of hours, I was able to get a sense of their business model. They generally don't have to deal with fluids or functional problems, since their customers generally have functioning vehicles that only need the exhaust work. That seems to take away a lot of aggravation from working on cars.

    2000 Grand Marquis LS HPP, a hand-me-down in 2008 with 128,000 km; 175,000 km as of July 2014
    mods: air filter box 'tuba', headlight relay harness, J-mod (around 186,350 km), 70mm throttle body, KYB Gas-A-Just shocks, aluminum driveshaft, ARA3 PCM

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