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The Merits of an HO swap

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    The Merits of an HO swap

    Just a reality check for those who's goal continues to be converting their CV/GM over to a HO configuration. A box stock Mustang with an AOD ran in the low to mid 15's with factory tires.
    Put the same engine and transmission into a CV/GM and you have a high 15 low 16 second car at best. If this is your end goal, then go for it. Don't sit and wonder why your HO conversion using stock factory HO parts doesn't get you into the 14's or doesn't give you the same sensation when you mash the gas as launching the space shuttle. Gears and exhaust will get you into the low 15's and you might even be able to squeek out a very high 14 second pass if you have a set of sticky tires. That is a big maybe depending on your tune.
    Compared to a stock set of E7's, GT-40P heads are good for an additional 30HP. This has been demonstrated over and over by dyno runs. An Explorer intake is near the same performance with a stock HO cam as a Cobra or even a GT-40 tube intake. This means an additional 10+HP.
    Right now, there are a pile of Explorer engines on car-part.com in the $400 range. You can get a 96 Explorer motor with non-P heads for a hundred or so more, but your compression will be lower, and mileage will be somewhat lower also. FRPP only sells standard stainless Mustang headers that fit P heads now, so they are reasonably priced and plentiful. They no longer bother to sell a standard ss set that doesn't fit.
    Add up the costs to do your conversion and you will find that an Explorer motor is one hell of a deal..........with an Explorer motor you get a solid shortblock, great heads, a cam pretty close to an HO cam, a great intake, a 65MM throttle body, 19LB injectors, and a cool upper intake cover plate.

    On another note, for those who do not realize it, there are tangible benefits in removing your factory fan and installing an electric fan. A stock fan has been proven to suck 20HP from a Mustang at track RPM's.

    #2
    HO swap was well worth it for me. Going from a stock 302 EFI to a new stock HO(94-95) is a huge difference!! Some things to note that the 94-95 Intake is different, aside from the bend that prevents me from turning it aroud, it is lower to the engine, and it comes with a much larger throttle body than old HO engines. I don't know about the injectors and all, but it is rated for more power than 86-93 HOs.

    I'll agree it's not like you get a 10sec car, but it's much better than stock and well worth the $2,000 that the whole engine cost me.

    Comment


      #3
      Originally posted by Blaze86Vic
      I'll agree it's not like you get a 10sec car, but it's much better than stock and well worth the $2,000 that the whole engine cost me.
      I just don't see it. $2000 was way too much to spend on just a factory HO motor.

      Comment


        #4
        That's from oil pan to throttle body to water pump to headers to fuel rails to wiring harness all as one unit. And that is NEW not used. $2000 is freakin awesome, normaly you couldn't touch that for less than $5000. And that is like a 50hp gain from the old setup.

        Comment


          #5
          Originally posted by Blaze86Vic
          That's from oil pan to throttle body to water pump to headers to fuel rails to wiring harness all as one unit. And that is NEW not used. $2000 is freakin awesome, normaly you couldn't touch that for less than $5000. And that is like a 50hp gain from the old setup.
          So you are saying that you were able to use the motor as supplied and just bolting it in without making any changes to the configuration? You used the SN95 fuel rails, harness, water pump..........?

          Comment


            #6
            Yep, exploder motor is a great deal. It's a great replacement for the lopo and comes with most of the go fast goodies. Won't threre be a bunch of missing emissions ports with the 97-up motors though? even the 96 ones with the standard GT-40's lose the air pump ports on the back of the heads.

            I paid 1550 for a complete brand new 96 motor, oil pan to intake, with wiring, injectors, oil cooler, etc...
            Builder/Owner of Badass Panther Wagons

            Busy maintaining a fleet of Fords

            Comment


              #7
              Yes, I used everything that came on the engine. And, and it was a complete 94-95 Mustang GT engine.

              Things that have never been removed.
              Headers,
              Water pump,
              Fuel rails,
              Throttle body,
              Water pump pully,
              Intake,
              Valve covers,
              Heads,
              Oil Pan,
              Even used the oil filter it came with.

              Comment


                #8
                Re: The Merits of an HO swap

                Originally posted by Mercracer
                On another note, for those who do not realize it, there are tangible benefits in removing your factory fan and installing an electric fan. A stock fan has been proven to suck 20HP from a Mustang at track RPM's.
                I did not notice any noteworthy gains at the track with my electric fan compared to the stock clutch fan. Definitely did not pick up 2 tenths. Maybe a few hundredths.

                I did not gain removing the serpentine belt compared to leaving it on driving the water pump and alternator with under-drive pulleys.

                When the car had the stock engine, I did see .1 to .15 quicker times with a short belt bypassing the power steering. The car has a manual rack in it now so the gain is always there.

                On another note, I gained less than a tenth running an open H pipe with the mufflers unbolted, but still hanging from the body. The mufflers are 2.25" Walker dynomax with 2.25" flow tubes. I was considering putting some quiet high flow mufflers on like the Borlas, but wanted to see how much I would gain over the current ones. Some guys gain from open headers when they take the weight of the exhaust off the car too.

                When my Mustang had a stock engine, I gained a couple tenths changing from 2.73 gears to 3.27s. I did not ET better with 3.73 gears compared too 3.27s. The best mod I did for my car was G6015 American Racer dirt track tires. The tires, 3.27s, and short belt improved the car from a 14.4 to a 13.9. I can drive it a little better now, so I imagine I could have done better when it was stock.

                A 5spd trans compared to an AOD might be one of the best bang for the buck mods. If a stock stang with an aod goes 14.9 and one with a t5 and 2.73s goes 14.4, that is .5 seconds. www.fordmuscle.com had a green mustang project car that started out as an aod car and was swapped to a t5. They picked up several tenths.

                Tom

                Comment


                  #9
                  I did an HO swap in my car because she needed an engine anyway. I got the parts car for $200, pulled the complete engine and ECM and junked the rest. Trans was toast and my gears were already better. All told I'm sure I got the engine+trans installed for under 2k. Probably under $1500, but I'm too scared to go looking at all the reciepts. In all honesty, I'd probably not have done the engine swap if the original engine wasn't knocking and running with zero oil pressure.
                  86 Lincoln Town Car (Galactica).
                  5.0 HO, CompCams XE258,Scorpion 1.72 roller rockers, 3.55 K code rear, tow package, BHPerformance ported E7 heads, Tmoss Explorer intake, 65mm throttle body, Hedman 1 5/8" headers, 2.5" dual exhaust, ASP underdrive pulley

                  91 Lincoln Mark VII LSC grandpa spec white and cranberry

                  1984 Lincoln Continental TurboDiesel - rolls coal

                  Originally posted by phayzer5
                  I drive a Lincoln. I can't be bothered to shift like the peasants and rabble rousers

                  Comment


                    #10
                    I still havent put any real money into an engine. My new shortblock was only $200. The biggest block of money is in the trans. Everything thats done just provides a great platform for future upgrades. I have a good intake, exhaust, ignition, cooling, and fuel system. Any lower engine stuff I do will produce that much more power from having the rest already taken care of.

                    RIP Jason P Harril, we'll miss ya bro

                    '80 Town Coupé
                    '84 Towncar - Teh Cobra TC, 408w powered
                    '16 Ram 1500 CC Outdoorsman, Hemi/3.92/8sp 4x4

                    Comment


                      #11
                      The only thing that I don't like about the explorer motor is the amount of stuff that needs to be swapped out. Everything has to come off the motor. I could have left the cam in, but I heard that it doesn't do much over 4500rpm. Another issue with the motor, if you swap the cam is the valvesprings. They also need to be replaced or they will float the valves around 5k.

                      So, I had a complete motor. Now it's been alll the way down to just a longblock. Should run pretty good though.
                      Builder/Owner of Badass Panther Wagons

                      Busy maintaining a fleet of Fords

                      Comment


                        #12
                        Re: The Merits of an HO swap

                        Originally posted by TommyN
                        I did not notice any noteworthy gains at the track with my electric fan compared to the stock clutch fan. Definitely did not pick up 2 tenths. Maybe a few hundredths.
                        When my Mustang had a stock engine, I gained a couple tenths changing from 2.73 gears to 3.27s. I did not ET better with 3.73 gears compared too 3.27s.
                        All I can say is that your results illustrate how AOD cars are different than 5-speed cars and that one person may see different results than another. I picked up over .5 seconds with just a gear change from my 2.73's. I have seen an electric fan change alone make well over .10 differance.

                        Comment


                          #13
                          Originally posted by mrltd
                          The only thing that I don't like about the explorer motor is the amount of stuff that needs to be swapped out. Everything has to come off the motor. I could have left the cam in, but I heard that it doesn't do much over 4500rpm. Another issue with the motor, if you swap the cam is the valvesprings. They also need to be replaced or they will float the valves around 5k. .
                          Any minor changes that need to be made to fit your application including valve springs still equate to a huge bargain. I am all for a couple of hours work to save over $1000 and be making 50+ more HP.

                          Comment


                            #14
                            [quote="Mercracer
                            Any minor changes that need to be made to fit your application including valve springs still equate to a huge bargain. I am all for a couple of hours work to save over $1000 and be making 50+ more HP.[/quote]

                            Yeah, the deal I got was awesome for a brand new motor. way cheaper than rebuilding my old HO converted motor. Though the exhaust ports on my old heads are a tad larger than the Gt-40's...

                            Bit if you look at all the money spent on the parts to use in a panther, it adds up quite a bit. I had some of the parts sitting around so I saved a couple hundred bucks, but I still spent a couple hundred...

                            Valve covers
                            Timing Cover
                            Cam
                            Timing Chain (double roller instead of the "silent" ford one
                            Valve Springs
                            Harmonic balancer
                            Oil pan
                            Various bolts (ie.oil pan bolts)
                            Oil pump pickup tube
                            Oil pan gasket
                            Timing Cover gaskets
                            Intake manifold gaskets
                            Builder/Owner of Badass Panther Wagons

                            Busy maintaining a fleet of Fords

                            Comment


                              #15
                              Originally posted by mrltd
                              Though the exhaust ports on my old heads are a tad larger than the Gt-40's...

                              Bit if you look at all the money spent on the parts to use in a panther, it adds up quite a bit. I had some of the parts sitting around so I saved a couple hundred bucks, but I still spent a couple hundred...
                              What were your old exhaust ports?

                              Unless you bought a panther without an engine, there are not any hard parts that you have to buy. A gasket set is about it.

                              Comment

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