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My '85 MGM, "Maisa"

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    The rattle doesn't sound like lifter tick though. Sounds more like spark knock. I would just double check the timing to make sure it's not moved for some weird reason. If it's still at 10, try backing it down to 2 and see if it clears up. I know some of the truck engines prefer 2 base.

    Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former. -- Albert Einstein
    rides: 93 Crown Vic LX (The Red Velvet Cake), 2000 Crown Vic base model (Sandy), 2003 Expedition (the vacation beast)

    Originally posted by gadget73
    ... and it should all work like magic and unicorns and stuff.

    Originally posted by dmccaig
    Overhead, some poor bastards are flying in airplanes.

    Comment


      I don't think this story will have a happy ending...

      I verified timing again and played with it some more, doesn't change the rattle. Also popped open the driver side valve cover, nothing loose under there either.
      The engine ran for about ~30 minutes more while I was playing around with it, the rattle might be getting slightly louder, but a faint knocking sound appeared and the engine is shaking alot more while idling.

      I'll drop the oil tomorrow, this evening I'll just wallow in foreboding sadness.
      1985 Mercury Grand Marquis LS, "Maisa"
      2005 Volvo V70 Bi-Fuel

      Comment


        engine shaking makes me think misfire. Bad plug, plug wire, rotor/cap... definitely something to check.

        Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former. -- Albert Einstein
        rides: 93 Crown Vic LX (The Red Velvet Cake), 2000 Crown Vic base model (Sandy), 2003 Expedition (the vacation beast)

        Originally posted by gadget73
        ... and it should all work like magic and unicorns and stuff.

        Originally posted by dmccaig
        Overhead, some poor bastards are flying in airplanes.

        Comment


          The rockers are just tightened until they hit torque. Its not a Chevy, they don't do the turn past the point where it stops clacking thing Fords you have to measure preload, something like 20-60 thousandths of an inch past zero lash, or like 1/2 to 1 1/4 turns past zero lash to the 20 ft-lb or whatever the spec is. If it turns more or less than that, you need different pushrods, or possibly shims depending which direction the problem is. Factory rockers, cam, stock replacement lifters, stock heads, and stock replacment head gaskets I'd expect to all play just fine though

          the pushrods are a different length from roller to flat tappet though, I'm just assuming you are using the pushrods fro a roller cam.


          kinda sounds valvetrain adjustment related to me.
          86 Lincoln Town Car (Galactica).
          5.0 HO, CompCams XE258,Scorpion 1.72 roller rockers, 3.55 K code rear, tow package, BHPerformance ported E7 heads, Tmoss Explorer intake, 65mm throttle body, Hedman 1 5/8" headers, 2.5" dual exhaust, ASP underdrive pulley

          91 Lincoln Mark VII LSC grandpa spec white and cranberry

          1984 Lincoln Continental TurboDiesel - rolls coal

          Originally posted by phayzer5
          I drive a Lincoln. I can't be bothered to shift like the peasants and rabble rousers

          Comment


            Oil is quite metallic, some glitter set into the bottom of the drain pan, dunno if it's alot or not for first break-in oil.
            I cut open the oil filter, no chunks, no flakes and barely even glittery. So most of the shiny bits was mixed in the oil.
            Dunno what to think of this.

            For my next move I think I'll get another can of oil and go through the rocker adjustment with the engine running. I'll mark the positions of the rocker bolts beforehand.
            The factory preload setting procedure is kinda ass to do in the car, besides, it went nicely when I did on the engine stand. What I don't understand is how the lifters being pumped up or not would affect the end result. Surely the lifter would bleed down before the valve opens.

            EDIT: Also pulled a few plugs and did a compression test on nr. 2 & 3 (what for having two hands a shit tester) Plugs look mint, barely any variation and compression was around 140 for both. Before the engine started shaking yesterday, it had ran very smooth and the exhaust note has always been very smooth.

            Zoom for shinies:
            Click image for larger version  Name:	20240509_134321.jpg Views:	0 Size:	1.45 MB ID:	1397104
            Last edited by Arquemann; 05-09-2024, 09:29 AM.
            1985 Mercury Grand Marquis LS, "Maisa"
            2005 Volvo V70 Bi-Fuel

            Comment


              The oil looks "normal" to me from what I've seen on first run break-in. Maybe even less shiny than some. I know the initial oil change on my generator looked worse than this. Even the last oil change still had glitter, but I'm also still less than 25 hours on it (barely to 10 hours) after 3 years of maintenance runs and one power outage that lasted a good while (4+ hours). Runs like a top though. So I'm sure you're fine right now.

              Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former. -- Albert Einstein
              rides: 93 Crown Vic LX (The Red Velvet Cake), 2000 Crown Vic base model (Sandy), 2003 Expedition (the vacation beast)

              Originally posted by gadget73
              ... and it should all work like magic and unicorns and stuff.

              Originally posted by dmccaig
              Overhead, some poor bastards are flying in airplanes.

              Comment


                lifter bleed-down is unrelated. There is a spring inside, that will keep the lifter at max length and thats all you need for preload.

                do not try to set this while running. It does not work. There is no means to keep the bolts from rotating back out, the only way to do this is to set the bolts to correct torque.

                If the preload was right when you did it on the stand, its still right.
                86 Lincoln Town Car (Galactica).
                5.0 HO, CompCams XE258,Scorpion 1.72 roller rockers, 3.55 K code rear, tow package, BHPerformance ported E7 heads, Tmoss Explorer intake, 65mm throttle body, Hedman 1 5/8" headers, 2.5" dual exhaust, ASP underdrive pulley

                91 Lincoln Mark VII LSC grandpa spec white and cranberry

                1984 Lincoln Continental TurboDiesel - rolls coal

                Originally posted by phayzer5
                I drive a Lincoln. I can't be bothered to shift like the peasants and rabble rousers

                Comment


                  Fine, I guess. Still not quite sure on the adjustment basis on these bolt on rockers, so I'll take your word for it.
                  As you said, I'm using all original or stock replacement parts on the valvetrain.

                  I guess I'll remove the timing cover next. If I can't find anything wrong under there, it's engine out. Might pop off the intake before that, maybe.
                  Too bad I already poured a new can of oil in.
                  1985 Mercury Grand Marquis LS, "Maisa"
                  2005 Volvo V70 Bi-Fuel

                  Comment


                    Opened the timing cover and intake, nothing seems out of place or broken. All lifters seem fine and none sit too low in the bores or such.
                    Time to pull the engine! After I pull myself together first...
                    1985 Mercury Grand Marquis LS, "Maisa"
                    2005 Volvo V70 Bi-Fuel

                    Comment


                      Can you not simply drive the car, as is and see how it performs and what the oil looks like after a reasonable period of time?
                      What I Own: 1993 Mercury Grand Marquis GS
                      What I Help Maintain: 1996 CV / 1988 CV / 1988 Tempo

                      Comment


                        Get the oil pan off and if there's nothing weird, I'd say just shove it back in and drive it a while and see if it quiets down after 500-1000 miles.

                        Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former. -- Albert Einstein
                        rides: 93 Crown Vic LX (The Red Velvet Cake), 2000 Crown Vic base model (Sandy), 2003 Expedition (the vacation beast)

                        Originally posted by gadget73
                        ... and it should all work like magic and unicorns and stuff.

                        Originally posted by dmccaig
                        Overhead, some poor bastards are flying in airplanes.

                        Comment


                          No, I'm taking out the engine. For fuck's sake I can hear the rattle from across the yard and over the exhaust with my face next to the tailpipe.
                          Those are not healthy gasoline engine noises and bad noises rarely go away without harm. I'm not driving it like that. It'd be nonsensical to have a "rebuilt" engine make that kind noise and try to play it off as normal.

                          I am not financially or mentally in the position to grenade a 302 because "maybe the sound will go away". I'm in Finland and here you can't find small blocks in every attic and behind every tree stump.

                          No. Just no.
                          1985 Mercury Grand Marquis LS, "Maisa"
                          2005 Volvo V70 Bi-Fuel

                          Comment


                            That is unfortunate. I do hope you find what is going on. Not ever finding out would drive me crazy.

                            I had to chuckle at your last comment:

                            I'm in Finland and here you can't find small blocks in every attic and behind every tree stump.

                            I have two 5.0s up in a barn lol.
                            ~David~

                            My 1987 Crown Victoria Coupe: The Brown Blob
                            My 2004 Mercedes Benz E320:The Benz

                            Originally posted by ootdega
                            My life is a long series of "nevermind" and "I guess not."

                            Originally posted by DerekTheGreat
                            But, that's just coming from me, this site's biggest pessimist. Best of luck

                            Originally posted by gadget73
                            my car starts and it has AC. Yours doesn't start and it has no AC. Seems obvious to me.




                            Comment


                              Do you have a borescope? If so, scope the tops of the pistons and check the edges to see if there's an impression of the heads that would indicate piston slap. Hopefully you don't have to pull the heads off.

                              Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former. -- Albert Einstein
                              rides: 93 Crown Vic LX (The Red Velvet Cake), 2000 Crown Vic base model (Sandy), 2003 Expedition (the vacation beast)

                              Originally posted by gadget73
                              ... and it should all work like magic and unicorns and stuff.

                              Originally posted by dmccaig
                              Overhead, some poor bastards are flying in airplanes.

                              Comment


                                Originally posted by sly View Post
                                Do you have a borescope? If so, scope the tops of the pistons and check the edges to see if there's an impression of the heads that would indicate piston slap. Hopefully you don't have to pull the heads off.
                                I do have one, but its more of a generic use one, resolution is garbage and it does poorly in low light. But I can say there's still a piston in every hole, no big dents or chunks missing off them and no extra bits laying on top.
                                1985 Mercury Grand Marquis LS, "Maisa"
                                2005 Volvo V70 Bi-Fuel

                                Comment

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