fastest box?

[Mercracer]

I don't see why you couldn't go high 14s with the Explorer engine. Especially when he has already gone 14.30s with GT40 top end (so, its not quite an 'Explorer engine'), stock converter, and 4.10s.

My reading comprehension sucked last night. 14.3s with a stock AOD, stock suspension and 4.10s is a decent time for a CV/GM and I would not be disappointed at all. There is likely alot of ET left on the table. I saw a Factory Stock Mustang with E7 heads run mid 12s. Taking a high mile factory engine and bolting parts on it is not guaranteed to produce the same results with 2 different engines. Without dyno runs, etc., there is no way of knowing how much power you are really making throughout the full RPM range.

[86VickyLX]

Doesn't merc91 run high 14s with his Explorer motor? I can't remember what he's done to it but it's not entirely stock...cam etc likely.

XE258 cam I think, a stock slipping AOD and I think 3.55s.

[Mustang Eddie]

You didn't simply take a stock Mustang 5.0, bolt GT40 heads and intake on it and run 12.1@111.

You may not believe it but yes I did.It had long tubes,pulleys,adjustable fp regulator ,4.10's & slicks & a completely stock factory shortblock with the stock HO cam retarded 4 degrees.(I bought the car new & didn't take the short out of the car until 94).Again it was & is a dedicated race car & the Merc isn't & I made hundreds of passes flogging it for every hundreth.

[Mustang Eddie]

[QUOTE=Mercracer;623646] Did you take the same exact (equivalent) engine and electronics, etc from the Mustang and put them in your Panther?

Actually it was the same exact engine.Moved on to a new engine in the Mustang & had the original sitting on the stand with 12k miles on it ready to go in the Merc when I bought it.

[Mustang Eddie]

My reading comprehension sucked last night. 14.3s with a stock AOD, stock suspension and 4.10s. I saw a Factory Stock Mustang with E7 heads run mid 12s.

The Merc doesn't have a stock AOD just a stock converter.Realistically at best maybe I've left a half second on the table not the 1+ second difference I'm seeing.You keep referencing NMRA F/S which started in 1999 or 2000 forgetting the EFI 5.0 Mustangs came out in 1986.If you look up 5.0 Mustang history Brian Wolfe went 11.60's with the GT-40 stuff in the late 80's.I went low 12's in 1992 & If you talk to the founders of the NMRA F/S was based around stuff I & a few other guys had already done in the late 80's early 90's.

[Mercracer]

You keep referencing NMRA F/S which started in 1999 or 2000 forgetting the EFI 5.0 Mustangs came out in 1986.If you look up 5.0 Mustang history Brian Wolfe went 11.60's with the GT-40 stuff in the late 80's.I went low 12's in 1992 & If you talk to the founders of the NMRA F/S was based around stuff I & a few other guys had already done in the late 80's early 90's.

I am bringing it up as a benchmark of factory parts. All cars have to weigh a minimum number and were restricted to actual factory cams. Throttle body and MAF sizes were restricted. It is the slowest EFI class. When it originated, these were daily drivers with a minimum number of bolt ons and factory short blocks for the most part. Within a couple of years the competitive cars were dedicated racers and running high 11s with blueprinted engines. If it was so easy on day 1 or even year 1, we would have seen low 12 second cars. It wasn't about being able to do it, it was being able to do it within the FS rules. NHRA Stock Class Mustangs have rules which are not as stringent regarding stock components. You can't compare those cars with FS cars.
A Fox Mustang came from the factory with a better tuned suspension than a Box CV/GM did. AOD Mustangs were up to a second slower than their 5-speed brothers when FS took off. I bring this up because you are comparing a modified Mustang to a less modified CV. I am comparing an unmodified Mustang with an unmodified CV and then bolting heads and intake, gears and exhaust on both.
I am loosing focus on what we are discussing here. That is what happens when working 12 hour night shifts on no sleep. I have drifted off topic.

[Mercracer]

I thought the same thing until I actually did the HO swap in my Merc.I've come to find that even though the Merc is about 1000 lbs.heavier than my Mustang with the same parts in the Merc it ran over 2 seconds slower.Now my Mustang is a dedicated race car the Merc is still my DD so I know I've left a bit of performance on the table but not 1 second+.......The AOD is a power robbing SOB & any full size box has the aerodynamics of um...a box lol. Not saying it's undo able but a little harder than you think.You need to be realistic & know that it's not going to be your DD to reach this performance goal.

I understand your point. A CV/GM is a pig and it takes more effort than 100 more HP to run the same times as a 1000# lighter Mustang. It makes sense. I would not be crushed if my box CV "only" ran low 14s with an Explorer heads & intake and a HO cam.

[Mustang Eddie]

I bring this up because you are comparing a modified Mustang to a less modified CV.

The engine in the Merc came directly out of my Mustang.The only difference is the AOD,the long tubes, slicks & a little over 1000lbs .The Merc is a turd out of the hole so slicks would make no difference,the long tubes to shorties are maybe a couple of tenths,& everything I've done AOD to stick was half a second difference.I felt at the worst the Merc would go 1.5 to 1.7 seconds slower than the Mustang did & when it went 2.2 to 2.7 seconds slower I was disappointed.

[Mustang Eddie]

I understand your point. A CV/GM is a pig and it takes more effort than 100 more HP to run the same times as a 1000# lighter Mustang. It makes sense. I would not be crushed if my box CV "only" ran low 14s with an Explorer heads & intake and a HO cam.

If I had no previous Mustang experience I too would have been very happy with 14.3's but my expectations were unfortunately a bit higher because of it lol.

[1980c10]

I'm sure there is alot being left on the table in the 60 ft. Department when compairing a 5 speed 3000lb stang with slicks to a aod box with a stock convertor and street tires. What's the difference between the two it could add up at the big end.

I believe my car is in the 15.60's area, but I have only ran 1/8th it's a bone stock H.O. From throttle body to oil pan, never been opened. No smog, no a/c, electric fan, 70mm mass air, 3" hot air intake, 1 5/8 headers, 2 1/2 exhaust, 4.30 gears, and 12 degrees of timing, through an aod with a pretty bad 1-2 slip and a stock convertor. I'm positive there is
0.5-0.7 left in it with a fresh trans and a higher stall. So I would think high 13's would be very possible with an exploder motor with alot a fiddling and a bunch of passes to get it dialed in. IDK it sure would be alot of fun to try though lol. I think it would all come down to how low you could get the 60ft though.

[johnunit]

was the converter in the merc stock panther chassis or stock mustang? there is supposedly a 200+RPM difference.

[Mustang Eddie]

I'm sure there is alot being left on the table in the 60 ft. Department when compairing a 5 speed 3000lb stang with slicks to a aod box with a stock convertor and street tires. What's the difference between the two it could add up at the big end.

I agree with you 100% here.I was not willing to compromise the Merc anymore than I already have.I already have a race car was not looking to make another.I'm pretty sure the right converter would knock a couple of tenths off my lousy best 2.09 60ft but at the cost of mileage & drive-ability.
On the highway it still manages to knock down 21 mpg & has no problem dragging the Stang on the trailer around . Overall I'm happy with the end product but my expectations were a bit high.

[Mustang Eddie]

was the converter in the merc stock panther chassis or stock mustang? there is supposedly a 200+RPM difference.

I have had both & a JC Whitney supposedly looser than stock rebuild in the car & they all stalled to the same RPM.

[P72Ford]

I am going to try and get my pile into the 13s this year. Not sure if it is realistic or not.

Fresher 304 (not sure how many miles; under 20K), P heads, Performer RPM Air Gap, 600 DP, Dirty Dog 3000, and 3.73s on 26" tires. Stock HO SD cam installed straight up (110 ICL), Cobra 1.7 RRs, FRPP headers, and Mustang/ Impala exhaust, and what I will refer to as Stage 1 weight reduction. A/C, smog, stereo, seat belts, and old wiring, etc removed, and the battery is in the trunk.

Its not up and running yet, because I am still working on a busted ass Chivvy. I should have some details worked out, and be able to run it sometime in July.

I am planning on running it on street radials. I will weigh the car as soon as I am done with it. I have future plans of lightening the bumpers, removing all the sound deadening, and a few other tricks.