19lb injectors without computer swap

[VicCrownVic]

We'll talk details via PM/offline at some point, but borrowing the engine hoist and stand from my dad should be doable.

[DerekTheGreat]

Sweet. Equipment & man power have me most worried. Second is my lack of skill and general nervousness when doing big stuff like that but I'll deal. Been telling Ashley she needs to update her thread and get talking to Stidman about that Mark VII

[knucklehead0202]

I'll try and get by the other car this week and grab that egr spacer, now that I know where the keys are, lol. STILL haven't had time to finish that thing off and get rid of it. There's a '91 GMQ on craiglist here local that I want to buy but have to dump the other car first.

[Giraffe]

It doesn't have enough compensation from the oxygen sensors to make it work unfortunately. The o2 sensor is for fine trim, not gross adjustment. The oxygen sensors also do not operate at wide open throttle or when cold, so you're stuck with the programmed fuel tables at that point.

There is a 10 or 15% ability to adjust In a mass air built in. There is a setting in the programming that allows for a 25% but need a tweecer or such to changes that setting.

Thanks for the explainer. Learn something everyday!

[DerekTheGreat]

I'll try and get by the other car this week and grab that egr spacer, now that I know where the keys are, lol. STILL haven't had time to finish that thing off and get rid of it. There's a '91 GMQ on craiglist here local that I want to buy but have to dump the other car first.

Wooord. You and Mercury's man lol. What's wrong with the one ya just picked up? How about a clean '89 TC that's triple blue? Would bring out the mob boss in you, comes complete with the wires wheels and set of winter tires you'll never need

[merc91]

Yes as far as I know the wot part of the table is set in stone and doesn't take any input from the o2's. Part throttle/cruise only as a mpg/emissions fine tuning means.

Big fan of the megasquirt here. The self tuning does suck but once you get the hang of writing tunes... you can work wonders. I dropped a full second in the 1/4 times with just porting and the computer electronics, picked up 15%mpg at cruise, and can e-tests again with cheap hi-flow cats... better than the 1st sniffer test it ever had not long after rolling off the lot in the early 90's.

We are at the point in gas prices, emissions regulations, and wanting to keep up with what a little damn 1.4l car can do these days, and be able to troubleshoot everything yourself... if keeping a box on the road is something you really want to pursue, electronics is a huge step forward.

[DerekTheGreat]

Yah well the little 1.4 liter car needs multiple camshafts, turbos and a 14 speed transmission to get it all done. They won't be on the road in 20 years like this stuff is. Plus, you can't work on 'em as easily either. In my mind if you just drive these the way they were built to do they're just peachy, puts a smile on my face.

[86VickyLX]

It doesn't have enough compensation from the oxygen sensors to make it work unfortunately. The o2 sensor is for fine trim, not gross adjustment. The oxygen sensors also do not operate at wide open throttle or when cold, so you're stuck with the programmed fuel tables at that point.

That is absolutely correct. Once you exceed that, all you get is a check engine light. The ford ecms from the factory are not fine tuned by any means. The fox computers are programmed with all kinds of fuel multipliers which alter the base table. So they ball park the MAF meter flow and use multipliers to get it close, and the o2 sensors get it closer. This is why, when you first start up your engine with a decent amount of mods, the car seems to run ok, then as you drive it, it progressively gets worse as the adaptives kick in and it may even stall. It's still running off of it's factory programmed 'good enough' tune. With that said, changing the injectors while keeping the same ecu with no tune is a really bad idea. Changing the computer to match the injectors, cam and such is a good start. But also know this. Not all 19lb 24lb 36lb etc injectors operate the same. For example, the 19lb injectors found on the Fox mustang and early 4.6 cars are not the same 19lb injectors found in explorer 5.0s. The cranking parameters, voltage offset table, and flow rates are completely different. I've recently found out all of this from dealing with my tuner.

[merc91]

Derek I'm with ya but there's so many 1.6 hondas and shit around with 300/400k on them around here and gas in canada is always hovering around $5/gal and our gov seems insistant on bending us over for emissions and continuing to cut the standards down on the older cars to get them off the road so it's that kinda situation here making things extreamely hard to keep 1 of these as a dd. If you are in that situation a swell, going aftermarket computer/electrinics and learning to write tunes is a massive help to allow us to keep doing what we want to do.

no emissions and $3/gal gas would make all the difference in the world tho.

[DerekTheGreat]

I no not about Hondas. I'd wager the 1.6 isn't fed by turbos or maybe even multiple cams though, nor are they 25+ years old. I certainly don't see 80's Hondas or the like on the road any more than I see our stuff floating around. My old 2.3 OHC Grand Am got over 32mpg, was a fine POS up until I was forced to give it to my uncle. What happened to it after he died is a mystery.

[turbo2256b]

I have a chart showing all the specks of Fords injectors up untill about 10 or 12 years ago.

[86VickyLX]

I have a chart showing all the specks of Fords injectors up untill about 10 or 12 years ago.

I would be interested in seeing that! Please post it when you get a chance!

[90ltd]

I think that a 15# injectors (from dual plug 4 cylinder mustang) instead of stock 14# will work great without any issues..

[90ltd]

Anything bigger won't work with stock ECU I would imagine.

[turbo2256b]

iTS NOT ABOUT The rate as much as other factors built into the injectors. I dont know of any different flow injector that has the same specs. Not sure were my chart is but there are about a dozen specs for each injector that could be different.