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VicCrownVic's 1998 Mercury Grand Marquis LS

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    #31
    Wiper motor on a box is about a million times easier. Even the last one that I did, which I modified the harness on the car to accept the single connector '95 part number motor.

    It turns out the closeout '95 part number motor doesn't line up exactly right on my '98. I swapped the mounting plate from my '98 motor onto the '95 motor, and with it installed the wipers parked up further than normal and the driver side wiper wiped the A-pillar. It didn't matter which motor arm I used. So apparently (I didn't make any measurements to confirm) the motor output shaft must be located slightly different in relation to the mounting plate-to-motor bolts. Swapped the new motor arm and what I assume is the parking mechanism onto the '98 mounting plate and onto the '98 motor. Wipers park in the correct spot and don't wipe the A-pillar. Time will tell if I actually did anything useful. Before all of this the wipers would park in the full up position, but not all the time. So far they have parked properly each time.
    Vic

    ~ 1989 MGM LS Colony Park - Large Marge
    ~ 1998 MGM LS - new DD
    ~ 1991 MGM LS "The Scab"
    ~ 1991 MGM GS "The Ice Car"

    Comment


      #32
      Wipers haven't acted up yet, they park like they should so I think I can call it fixed. I think someone messed with the wipers in the past. likely when the driver side fender was replaced (and possibly the hood) and painted. The passenger side wiper seems to not aligned quite right, like the wiper arm is off by a tooth at the base of the arm.

      I ordered a crankshaft position tool and camshaft holder set. I don't immediately need them, but at some point in the future I'm sure I will. I'm currently at 64K miles and change, what is the typical lifespan of the original timing chains, guides, and tensioners? Since I still have the original intake would it be worth replacing timing chains, guides, and tensioners while I'm replacing the intake or not really worth the time at 64K miles? Still need to order the intake. I'm a fan of keeping things easy, but if I end up going with a PI intake do I only need to get the coolant tube and nipple thing that lives under the intake (from an '03-ish in the JY)?
      Click image for larger version

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      Also ordered a 1998 service manual and EVTM. Got a really good deal on them, and everything appears to be there and in decent shape.
      Click image for larger version

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      Vic

      ~ 1989 MGM LS Colony Park - Large Marge
      ~ 1998 MGM LS - new DD
      ~ 1991 MGM LS "The Scab"
      ~ 1991 MGM GS "The Ice Car"

      Comment


        #33
        I think the '01-'03 timing chain guide and tensioner issue is more of an if than a when problem. I've heard multiple things. A. It's a 2001-2003 specific issue. B. It could happen with any 4.6 C. It's a 2003 only issue. I lean towards it's a lot like the self ejecting spark plug issue, it could happen but it's not necessarily ever going to happen to one particular engine. My '01 Town Car had 140k on it with original guides and tensioners and was perfectly quiet and running fine when I traded it in. I bought my '03 TC at 69k miles and it had already had them done, it had the x and three dashes on the valve covers. My current '02 LSE I don't know about. I have service records stating that the oil pan, intake, and valve cover gaskets were replace in May of 2019. Certainly it wasn't leaking from all those places? It hasn't burned or leaked any oil in the 6 weeks I've had it and I've put about 1200 miles on it already. So I'm thinking maybe that work was done with all the gaskets. I do have the intake with the aluminum crossover so that was done at some point. Either way it's at 98k miles and sounds and runs just fine.
        2002 Mercury Grand Marquis LSE, Sylvania Zevo LED Headlights, MSD Blaster Coils, K&N Cold Air Intake, Dual Exhaust, 3.27's - Dally Driver

        1983 Lincoln Continental Mark VI, Smog Delete - Summer Cruiser


        ‚Äč

        Comment


          #34
          I was leaning toward probably not worth the time to do timing chains and hardware since I don't have any funny noises or any reason to believe that they are warn, and I'm currently sitting at 64K miles.

          22 year old plastic on that intake is definitely a ticking time bomb, but hopefully it will be fine until I pre-emptively replace it. I still have The Scab and The Ice Car (until I decide to permanently retire it) for backup if that intake does decide to become problematic.
          Vic

          ~ 1989 MGM LS Colony Park - Large Marge
          ~ 1998 MGM LS - new DD
          ~ 1991 MGM LS "The Scab"
          ~ 1991 MGM GS "The Ice Car"

          Comment


            #35
            My understanding of the timing chain tensioner issue is that it was "some" 00-03:



            I've never seen anything about an issue with the chains themselves. I would figure they could go for at least 300,000 miles. The same may be true for guides, arms, and tensioners for 98, but don't hold me to that. I once saw or heard something about the issue being a bad batch of nylon on the tensioner arms, and I don't recall ever seeing an issue for pre-00.

            The PI intake swap by itself does not seem to be worth it for normal driving. The gains seem to be in the high RPM range. OTOH, PI camshafts might provide a decent complement for the PI intake, but I don't know. You could put PI heads on, but that reportedly requires use of high octane gas due to an increase in compression.

            If you do the PI intake swap, you should get a new nipple, and you might want to consider a new heater pipe. At the least, make sure any used pipe is in good shape, and maybe even give it a coat of high heat paint. You might be good with any 01+ heater pipe. They did change something at some point (I think 04), though it might still bolt up the same way. The only other thing I can think of for a PI intake swap is RTV on two of the coolant ports.

            Regardless of which intake you use, what would definitely be worthwhile (at least for those with dual exhaust) is porting and polishing the plenum and swapping the TB for a 70mm model. You might want to get a used plenum and work on it at your convenience so it's ready to go:


            2000 Grand Marquis LS HPP, a hand-me-down in 2008 with 128,000 km; 175,000 km as of July 2014
            mods: air filter box 'tuba', headlight relay harness, J-mod (around 186,350 km), 70mm throttle body, KYB Gas-A-Just shocks, aluminum driveshaft, ARA3 PCM

            Comment


              #36
              Thanks for the info. I'm only planning on this being a daily driver, so I'm not too worried about going with an improved (metal crossover) NPI intake to replace my original, plastic crossover, NPI intake.
              Although, if I decide at some point down the road to have some fun with the car, those modifications you have there look to be within my skillset.

              There are two kits that I have come across.
              F8AZ-9424-BAA which I assume includes the NPI manifold (https://www.tascaparts.com/oem-parts...re-f8az9424baa)
              and
              1W7Z-9424-AAA which I assume includes the PI manifold (https://www.tascaparts.com/oem-parts...re-1w7z9424aaa)

              I've been looking over Ryan's write up on manifold replacement/PI manifold upgrade. With a 5.0 I can look at a write up like that and not be lost, I'd know the finer details even if they were missed in the write up.
              With a 4.6, I feel like I miss details that are right in front of my face in the write up because I can't imagine a 4.6 in my head like I can a 5.0. lol
              I think the thought of modifying something I'm not at all familiar with seems a bit intimidating, even though I may be capable.

              While attempting to write this post I did more digging, and I guess it wouldn't be that bad to do the NPI manifold. It looks like I can get that coolant tube and nipple on Rockauto. Both Dorman parts but I assume, unlike the intake manifold itself, that these parts are ok?

              I was a bit hesitant at the idea of removing the water pump to replace the nipple, but I'm used to the 5.0 where every accessory attaches to at least one point on the water pump. The 4.6 water pump is just a few bolts and that's it?

              I'm sure I'll have plenty more dumb questions since I know absolutely nothing about anything 4.6 specific.
              Vic

              ~ 1989 MGM LS Colony Park - Large Marge
              ~ 1998 MGM LS - new DD
              ~ 1991 MGM LS "The Scab"
              ~ 1991 MGM GS "The Ice Car"

              Comment


                #37
                FWIW, the timing chains and guides have never been done in my '97. Have nearly 220K on the clock and it runs good with no weird noises. Seems to be the later design stuff that usually needs more attention for longevity there.


                My Cars:
                -1964 Comet 202 (116K Miles) - Long Term Project
                -1986 Dodge D-150 Royale SE (112K Miles) - Slowly Getting Put Back Together
                -1987 Grand Marquis Colony Park LS (325K Miles) - April 2017 + September 2019 POTM Winner
                -1997 Grand Marquis LS (240K Miles) - The Daily Workhorse & March 2015 + January 2019 POTM Winner

                Comment


                  #38
                  Iíve heard 02 was a bad year for the timing chains on the 2v, just throwing that out there.

                  I would do the manifold swap, its only a matter of time before the npi plastic crossover fails. And a pi intake canít be beat. Theyíre readily available and not too expensive. Installing one on npi heads isnít bad, the biggest thing to remember is that the coolant ports are different shapes so a little bit of rtv needs to be added along with pi gaskets but otherwise its not bad.


                  Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

                  Comment


                    #39
                    Vic even if your not planning on doing any real work to your engine I highly recommend this book. I learned a ton from it. I donít know how knowledgeable you are about the modular motors but I knew nothing about them when I got my Ď95 MGM back in 2009.

                    Some of the more interesting things I learned

                    All mod motors have aluminum heads, pretty common knowledge but I didnít know back then.

                    Cross bolted mains with jack bolts on the Romeo (cast in Cleveland) blocks. So effectively 4 bolt mains.

                    You can change the oil pump without pulling the pan.

                    The stock cams are hollow tubes with the lobes pressed on.

                    It also covers the myriad of Windsor/Romeo interchangeability issues.

                    The bore and stroke of the 4.6 is nearly square. 3.552Ē x 3.543Ē

                    Externally a 4.6 is nearly as big as a 460 being 4Ē shorter, the same height and only 3/4Ē narrower. The DOHC is both wider and taller.



                    I also found this YouTube video while a bit long very interesting.

                    Share your videos with friends, family, and the world
                    2002 Mercury Grand Marquis LSE, Sylvania Zevo LED Headlights, MSD Blaster Coils, K&N Cold Air Intake, Dual Exhaust, 3.27's - Dally Driver

                    1983 Lincoln Continental Mark VI, Smog Delete - Summer Cruiser


                    ‚Äč

                    Comment


                      #40
                      I've actually came across that video a while ago (someone here probably posted it before). Tried to listen to it figuring some day I would own a 4.6. I listened to it while at work so didn't hear it all and wasn't paying close attention. Perfect time to watch it now.
                      That book looks like a great resource, and should nicely compliment my service manual.

                      Great info from all you mangs. As a 4.6 n00b, I really appreciate it.
                      Vic

                      ~ 1989 MGM LS Colony Park - Large Marge
                      ~ 1998 MGM LS - new DD
                      ~ 1991 MGM LS "The Scab"
                      ~ 1991 MGM GS "The Ice Car"

                      Comment


                        #41
                        the wiper parking thing I believe is a cam inside the motor gear assembly. Might be able to swap the one out of the 95 motor into the original and make the wipers behave as they should.
                        86 Lincoln Town Car (Galactica).
                        5.0 HO, CompCams XE258,Scorpion 1.72 roller rockers, 3.55 K code rear, tow package, BHPerformance ported E7 heads, Tmoss Explorer intake, 65mm throttle body, Hedman 1 5/8" headers, 2.5" dual exhaust, ASP underdrive pulley

                        91 Lincoln Mark VII LSC grandpa spec white and cranberry

                        1984 Lincoln Continental TurboDiesel - rolls coal

                        Originally posted by phayzer5
                        I drive a Lincoln. I can't be bothered to shift like the peasants and rabble rousers

                        Comment


                          #42
                          I've got an original '91 motor I can rip into. Perhaps I'll take a look at that today to get a better idea of the inner workings.
                          Vic

                          ~ 1989 MGM LS Colony Park - Large Marge
                          ~ 1998 MGM LS - new DD
                          ~ 1991 MGM LS "The Scab"
                          ~ 1991 MGM GS "The Ice Car"

                          Comment


                            #43
                            The timing set on my 93's original engine was still in okay shape when the engine ate a valve at 200K. You could however SHAVE with the ends of the cam gear teeth. Those things were sharp. It definitely was showing signs of wear, but it still ran fine until it bent that valve. The general theory is that the unremoved casting flash on the head caught the intake valve and held it just long enough for the piston to slap it. We had just replaced the valve stem seals too. There's additional theory that the valve spring was too soft, but we never measured that.

                            Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former. -- Albert Einstein
                            rides: 93 Crown Vic LX (The Red Velvet Cake), 2000 Crown Vic base model (Sandy), 2003 Expedition (the vacation beast)

                            Originally posted by gadget73
                            ... and it should all work like magic and unicorns and stuff.

                            Originally posted by dmccaig
                            Overhead, some poor bastards are flying in airplanes.

                            Comment


                              #44
                              Originally posted by VicCrownVic View Post
                              ... Both Dorman parts but I assume, unlike the intake manifold itself, that these parts are ok?

                              I was a bit hesitant at the idea of removing the water pump to replace the nipple, but I'm used to the 5.0 where every accessory attaches to at least one point on the water pump. The 4.6 water pump is just a few bolts and that's it?

                              I'm sure I'll have plenty more dumb questions since I know absolutely nothing about anything 4.6 specific.
                              The 4.6 is reasonably straightforward. For me, it's always a matter of the engineers seeming to make things without much regard for repairs, and that's probably the biggest issue rather than any kind of intrinsic complexity. Dunno about the Dorman pipe and nipple, but it's hard to imagine they could mess up something so simple. I'm not sure if replacing the nipple is actually necessary if your pipe does not have the little piece of hose where it sits on the nipple, but I'll leave that for someone else. The water pump is indeed that simple.

                              Something quick that you could do without spending any money is removing the restrictive trumpet from the air filter box if you haven't already done so. That in itself should give you some sense of whether you want to bother with the other stuff.

                              Also, I forgot to note that the 70mm TB might result in the gas pedal being a bit higher, and you would most likely have to readjust the cruise control cable in any event (remove clip, let cable extend, reinsert clip). If you want to guarantee that the pedal will come up, you can use one of the plastic TB comb gaskets after removing the combs. My gas pedal is almost level with the brake pedal, which works for me.

                              2000 Grand Marquis LS HPP, a hand-me-down in 2008 with 128,000 km; 175,000 km as of July 2014
                              mods: air filter box 'tuba', headlight relay harness, J-mod (around 186,350 km), 70mm throttle body, KYB Gas-A-Just shocks, aluminum driveshaft, ARA3 PCM

                              Comment


                                #45
                                You do not need to worry about timing chain guides or tensioners since you have the much better design. You already have metal tensioners. (which is what ford used to replace the 2001-3s during the recall).
                                2004-2011 4.6s use a stupid plastic tensioner garbage setup. It causes the engine to knock at start up while they pump up. If ford had stuck to the metal design that they used for nearly two decades, things would have been fine. But to save a few bucks...

                                I would not wait on the intake. Ill show you a picture later of the failure the 96-01s. Believe you can use/modify a ford motorsports intake instead of a Dorkman intake.
                                -Nick M.
                                Columbia, SC

                                66 Squire, 89 Colony Park, 90 TC, 03 TC, 06 TC, 07 TC (2x)
                                03 BMW 540iT, 07 Toyota Tundra SR5 Dbl Cab/5.7 2WD

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