460

[1984colonypark]

460=1 302 t5=0 i need more votes

[Mercracer]

at least someone still remembers what this thread is about.

You can put an AOD behind your 460 you know....

[Mercracer]

460=1 302 t5=0 i need more votes

Since there is nothing "free" about putting a 460 in, it likely is not the combo for you, especially since you kept the smog pistons and likely camshaft....
Just find yourself a low mileage Explorer engine and convert your car to carb until you save up the cash to build a monster 460 or 351W. Stick with an AOD until you can afford a stout tranny and the associated hardware...

[P72Ford]

I would forget the 460 myself. But I haven't ever been a proponent of the 460 swap.

302/ AOD with thoughtful drivetrain modification. Converter, VB, gears, etc.

A properly shifting automatic is truly a pleasure to drive.

[ford man]

A 460 with a straight up timing chain, dual plane and 650-750cfm carbuerator would get you down the road in a hurry... BIG torque hit too. You for sure would want a limited slip rear with all that torque- something to consider in your decision making. What gears are in the car now? It's super easy to do a shift kit on a c6 trans too. Get that wagon barkin the tires! A 460 would not be happy with 2" exhaust, something else to consider...

[grandpaslincoln]

A timing chain and a different carburetor aren't going to fix a smog motor.

[ford man]

A timing chain and a different carburetor aren't going to fix a smog motor.

Please elaborate

[grandpaslincoln]

The problem isn't the carburetor or a timing chain. A smog motor has smog heads, smog pistons, smog cam, and just about everything else that could be designed to make a smog motor what it is. Simply putting a different carburetor on and changing the cam timing aren't going to fix the real performance robbing components of the engine.

[1990LTD]

In a smog motor almost everything besides the block is there to choke the motor into producing less power. You've got lots of displacement with a 460 but none of the parts on the motor are designed to make ANY use of the available displacement

Pistons hardly make any compression, combustion chambers look like half grapefruits, thermactor nonsense, cam shits the bed after 2000 revs, etc, etc, etc

[grandpaslincoln]

Basically you get a big block motor that puts out 200 horsepower. Pretty disgusting stuff. It's even worse looking at performance charts of engines when you go down the year column. The HP and torque ratings go down the shitter as you creep into the 70's and up.

[1990LTD]

yep...i think the 60s mark III has something like 150hp on the 70s mark series IV and V with the 460. probably measured differently but still..there's not THAT much driveline loss

[grandpaslincoln]

When HP measurement was changed from Gross to Net power in 71-72 the figures went down more.

[Mercracer]

When HP measurement was changed from Gross to Net power in 71-72 the figures went down more.

From 71 to 72 pistons with craters were added, a huge open chamber combustion chamber was added, the exhaust port was altered, the cam was changed and the intake/carb were changed. 1972 was the low point for 385 series heads with the exception of the 429 PI head (D2OE). The D2AE combustion chamber shape and size was truly an abomination. It is quite possibly the worst design in the history of the internal combustion engine.

In a smog motor almost everything besides the block is there to choke the motor into producing less power. You've got lots of displacement with a 460 but none of the parts on the motor are designed to make ANY use of the available displacement

Pistons hardly make any compression, combustion chambers look like half grapefruits, thermactor nonsense, cam shits the bed after 2000 revs, etc, etc, etc

The 1973-1979 head is not a terrible head. You can make plenty of power with the D3AE head. The compression chambers are not hemispherical (look like half grapefruit). While the volume is larger than the 1968-71 heads, the shape is not terrible. An intake, piston cam change can turn a 70s boat anchor into a torque monster.

[ford man]

Ok my points are this:

Compression ration goes hand in hand with effecency, power, fuel economy but every compression ratio calculator I can find say 1 point compression is worth 3-5 percent horsepower more or less.

The smog timing sets have 8 degrees cam retard built into the sprockets. When I changed the timing chain on my 400 Gran Torino to a straight up double roller and put on an edelbrock performer intake the diffference in performance was night and day.

In my opinion the cranking compression of an engine is a clearer indication of the potential for power. How much the valves open and how much air is squeezed into the cylinder. Maybe 1984colonypark should do a compression check on his 460... probably a wet test since hes not able to start it.

Please keep in mind were talking about a 158 cube difference in displacement compared to a 302. I maintain the 460 is going to have more power to offer in a big heavy wagon.

Is 1984 colony park going to be running catalytic converters? Those early converters 'smog motors had, eat up alot of power. Also early egr systems strangle the engine. The 8 degree cam retard. I think a 70's 302 was making around 130 hp with these systems compared to 200 something on the 460s. Once you start taking these smog systems off you get power back quick... especially when your talking about 460 cubes.

A 460 is going to raise that front end and have you jumpin out ahead at those traffic lights. Ford probably would've put a 460 in there originally if it wasn't for the epa and cafe. This is a colony park not a mustang respectfully mind. Maybe I'm just old school but I think big blocks are cool.

[Mercracer]

The 460 was an option in the 70s in Full and Mid sized cars. Few people chose the extra cost and decrease in mileage as we were in a gas crunch. If Ford offered one in a Panter, it would have suffered the same fate of low demand.
When they were available, the 351C 4V motors outperformed them. In 1971 you could get a 429 or a 351 in a Mustang. Except for the solid lifter camshaft 429, the 351s beat the pants off of the 429s. If a solid lifter 460 with the CJ heads were available in a Mustang, the 351s would have been sucking their fumes. From 1972 to 1974, the 351s outperformed the 460s.
A 460 equipped Panther would weigh 4300+ lbs unless it were put on a diet.
In the quarter mile, it takes 10HP to make up for 100 lbs. That means that a 460 needs to make 30+ more HP to outrun a 302. A little less for a 351W (5-ish).
What this means is that an Explorer engine with an intake change will absolutely destroy your basic 70s 460 with an intake change. It would be pitiful.
If someone is going to go through the trouble of doing a 460 swap, they had better be putting in an upgraded engine or the effort and cost to performance ratio would be shameful.